Brandon Graham Is Chased Off Twitter By Eagles Fans

Eagles defensive end Brandon Graham could dress for the game on Sunday against the New York Jets because of the rib injury of Birds backup defensive end Darryl Tapp.  It will either be Graham or veteran defensive end Juqua Parker, who will get the chance to play.

This isn’t the type of situation which Graham is supposed to be in during the second season of his career, considering how the Eagles moved up to draft him with the 13th pick in the draft.

He has been chased off of Twitter.  Fans of the Birds haven’t been happy with his production especially when you compare it to a defensive end who was selected in the same 2010 draft.  The Eagles fans let Graham know that they wish the team had Jason Pierre-Paul rather than him.

Graham was selected two picks ahead of Pierre-Paul, but he hasn’t been able to shine the New York player’s shoes when it comes to production.  Pierre-Paul is having a Pro Bowl season, while Graham stands on the Eagles sidelines during games in his jeans and a sweatshirt.  It doesn’t take genius to see that so far the Birds made a mistake in taking Graham ahead of Pierre-Paul, so you can understand why Birds fans had no problem letting the defensive end know that they wish he was with the Giants and Pierre-Paul was with the Eagles.

“It’s ridiculous, how bad the fans are, saying how they wish they had JPP,” Graham said to reporters yesterday. “I understand, ’cause I haven’t done anything. I got nothing to say. That’s why I’ve been laying low, just can’t wait to erupt.”

If the Eagles are to win, everybody in the organization must be winning.  That includes the players, but it also includes the coaches and the front office.

It’s obvious that the players and coaches haven’t been performing well so far this season, but they haven’t been the only ones who are losing.  Andy Reid and Howie Roseman’s decision to draft Graham and leave Pierre-Paul on the board looks like a huge mistake.

Pierre-Paul is already one of the best all-around defensive ends in the NFL, right now.  He’s a big monster while Graham is undersized.

Pierre-Paul is a playmaker even on special teams. Pierre-Paul locked up a win for the Giants over the Cowboys on Sunday night when he blocked a field goal attempt by Dallas.  If you ask the Eagles offensive line who is the best defensive end on the Giants, they take their time answering but always mention Pierre-Paul along with Osi Umenyiora and Justin Tuck.

That’s quite a bit of respect for somebody in the their second-year when they’re mentioned along with Pro Bowlers.

Graham has a lot of work to do and he knows it.

“I think about that every day, just for me . . . Once I start doing something, the fans are going to be back on it. I just really want to do it for me. I know what I can do. I know I can help this team. That’s all I’m trying to do,” Graham said. “I hope I at least get one shot, at least break the ice, get something going, make a play, just to make me feel good.”

71 thoughts on “Brandon Graham Is Chased Off Twitter By Eagles Fans

  1. This story goes right off the comment I posted the other day after the giants/cowboys game in which JPP just dominated…Like I said before as much as a I want to rip BG for clearly being out of JPP league right now, he didn’t pick himself in the first round. He didn’t trade multiple picks to move up in the first round to select him. He didn’t pass on JPP. So i’ll give him next year to make an impact and “erupt” like he says…if he doesn’t by then, then he will be a bust whether he likes it or not. Im so over these players talking like their going to do big things but end up actually playing small over and over.

    This team needs major changes from top to bottom…Whoever has been evaluating talent on this team for the past 2 years needs to be fired immediately. The whole philosophy on this team needs a change. The defense needs a change from its soft, fastball BS. Im really interested to see if this FO has the balls to do what is needed on this team. I mean if this is not the definition of insanity than i don’t know what is. But hey, the defense finally showed up and it was only week 14 of the season against HOFer JP Losman and a line that was missing their pro-bowl tackle. so that makes it all better

  2. I don’t understand why some people are so afraid of change when it comes to this football team. Even if you look at the team next door like the Flyers, who year after year had a philosophy/players that were good but not good enough to win it all, the FO had balls and made a decision to go in another direction with the team. Whether it turns out for the better is still yet to be seen but you knew what you had with the previous and knew it would be just another good year but not good enough Same old story…so far its showing that change isn’t a bad thing overall.

  3. I re-read the article – where – anywhere in this fine journalistic blog – does it mention the relative performances of the 2 first round draft picks during their rookie seasons…. hmmm. Where does it mention that Graham was injured and went on season ending IR and had micro-fracture surgery………… where does it mention the typcial time it takes to recover from that micro-fracture surgery…. does it discuss what Graham is doing to return?

    Question – if the Eagles D was not such a total abortion this year – would this be of interest?

    Yes, Mr Cobb – you and Songs are onboard with saying – wow – wish we picked the guy that didn’t get hurt – real rocket science darft insight there – if only these damn draft picks came with money back warrenties –

    this si the typical – lets inflame the masses articles that crack me up – big monster while undersized – really – too funny –

  4. Maybe this year Roseman (god help us if he’s still the GM) will just use Kiper or McShay’s draft board. The birds would probably couldn’t draft any worse than they have the past two years. Just watching Earl Thomas on Monday all over the place still makes me wonder if anyone in that front office or scouting dept. has a &#$%ing clue. Not one impact player in two years. Go back to selling tickets Howie!

  5. You shouldnt be tweeting anyway….you should be lifting and studying the Jets o-lineman.

    Go get better and stop social media crap. Noone cares what your doing unless its merk’n qb’s and tackling backs behid the l.o.s..

  6. How aobut that LB that I wanted the Eagles to select last Draft KJ Wright.. he’s going to be a All_Pro for the next 6-8 Seasons along with S Earl Thomas
    and how about their other Safety Kam Chancellor from Virgina Tech.. There were a few posters real high on this kid and he’s about 6’3 240lbs and can run and know your head off.. Seattle gets their OL and QB positions situated, they could be a pretty good team and compete for a PLayoff spot, they have some talent,,,

  7. JPP was a real diamond in the rough and a high risk-high reward type of Draft Pick.. He’s only played a foootball a few years and actually only played about
    10-11 Games at the Division I level at Univesity of South Florida over his last 2 Seasons there. so there was no guarantee how he was going to pan out at the NFL Level… But here is something I am sure about.. The NY Giants do a tremendous job of developing their DL, they always have, while the Eagles simply do not (or at least have not in recent years)… Look at Giants DL past players like Strahan and current players like Umenyuri, Tuck and now JPP, none of these players where shoe-ins as having productive careers..

  8. More inept coaching? Suprise.

    Dude was on that sports science show before he got drafted. He did like 20 back handsprings in a row.Who saw that? After that show i thought….any man that size that can do that can get a sack when we need it. Howie and the boys thought it was just nice that he had a gymnastics backround.Just like they thought Allen outta S.Florida could outplay a guy who made plays at a big school like Texas. No reason to believe a player at Texas could make any plays at the next level.

  9. The guy is a freak athletically there is no denying that… But while in COllege, he shoewed some burts off and on and his engine and work ethic was questioned .. and again only played the game for a short time so there was not a real consistent pattern of making plays…
    Meanwhile B Graham was a 3 Year Starter at Michigan, played in lots of big games and really dominated during that Senior Week against some very highly rated OT that were all 1st Rouns Selections (Trent Willimas, R Okung,B Bulaga) and he beat those players consistently and looked great then entire week down in Mobile by all accounts and reports…
    Just like the small print on a Mutual Fund Prospectus, Past performance does not guarantee Future success.. the same with Football players…

  10. Paulman, I would not say JPP was a diamond in the rough at all…regardless of his short playing time he was easily rated the best DE on many boards so its not like its a surprise he is dominating as one of the best DE’s in the game right now…Further on your point, your basically just giving the Eagles another black eye by saying even if they draft the right players are coaches are so bad they will still not reach potential…Fact is Eagles screwed up period. They failed at their job. But who cares right? did you see how we dominated the Miami Dolphins. Better not make any changes and bring everybody back after that week 14 performance.

  11. Our F O can’t draft for crap. We may get a stud every 3 or 4 years (even still, he may have 1 probowl season and thats it), simple as that. These aren’t football thinking owners and Gm. Reid always go softy o-lineman and really doesn’t look at anything else. When he goes defense, it’s these so called small “high motor” weak 2nd-3rd rd picks that he drafts in the 1st round. Our drafting and F O are garbage. We never get big name drafts; we’re garbage.

  12. We need “Road Graders” on offense and defense, not these so called high motor small fries. look at the Ravens, Steelers and Patriots, you can even throw the saints and packers in there as well.

  13. the eagles traded UP to get Graham….when you make a move like that in the 1st round, you would think the guy you are going after is a “sure thing”.

    Yeah….no such thing as a “sure thing”…but why do we always go after the undersized guy?

  14. See right here in these last few posts is the enigma of Eagle fans – Compare JPP verse Graham – read Pmans comments on the guys coming out of college –

    Now direclty compare that to Danny Watkins – limited playing time – bit older, not as many games –

    so…. in each case – lets bitch – there is no standard – no ‘process’ – so if the draft pick works out – great drafting – if it doesn’t shitty drafting – and of course the addendum to that is the players get ZERO time to adjust – Watkins has had some really good games and some great blocks – Shawn Andrews missed his entore Rookie year with a borken leg and then went on to be the best G in the NFL the next three years – Graham was having a decent rookie year – his pedigree, his history, his combine stats (no this was not Mike Mamula who shot way up the boards at the combine) he was a star at Michagan who spent most of his career in the other teams backfield – quick name three teams South Florida plays without looking…… You know Graham face PS, Wisc, Mich State, OSU – every year with 100K in the stands – Graham was a solid draft choice that got injured… give the dude a chance to bounce back (like Shawn Andrews) – Pheags – gonna do some research on your claim JPP top DE in draft

  15. I would never have moved up 13 SLots to Draft Graham either.
    I would sat tight and at #24 went Center Maurice Pouncey (that went to the Steelers) or CB D McCOuney (that the Pats selected)
    There was a tonof good DE’s in that class, (Carlos Dunlap,Greg Hardy,etc,etc) all I am saying is the most the Draft news circulating that Year is that Graham was a safer pick than JPP due to a larger/longer body of work… Now if yuor basing on pure athleticism and upside, yes, than JPP had that, if you were looking for aplyer to come in constibute right away, thenm Graham was probalby the man, unfortunatley he got off to a slow start (Which I blame on an overall lack conditioning, then he played a few games and had some moment, then got hurt and was done for the Season)
    I believe his Coach was Rory Segrest during his Rookie Season which doesn;t say a whole lot either..I would not wirte him off, but there is no doubt that JPP is a beast and will be the next Pro-Bowl among the man that are cxoached well and coached up by the Giants year in and year out..
    If JPP was drafted by the Eagles, would he be playing as well, that’s no given either…

  16. Pheags – CBS Sports had JPP as the #2 DE and GRaham as the #1 OLB
    CFN, Walter Camp –

    No Pheags in all JPP was the #2 DE behind Derrick Morgan here is some commentary from Walter Camp –

    Jason Pierre-Paul has declared for the 2010 NFL Draft. I don’t get the hype with Pierre-Paul; he’s a one-year wonder who accumulated only 6.5 sacks despite the fact that George Selvie was drawing tons of attention on the other side. Is Pierre-Paul really gifted athletically? Absolutely. Would I take a shot on him in Round 2? Definitely. But I wouldn’t want to spend a first-round selection on a one-year wonder.

  17. Remember guys, during that draft we were also looking to replace BDawk…..while Earl Thomas has had mixed results in Seattle, I believe if not JPP, than Thomas would have made more sense.

    P-man, I think your Pouncy pick is more hindsight being 20/20 than something you would have said at the time.

  18. See Graham was viewed on most draft boards as a 3-4 pass rushing OLB – here is some commentary in Graham – Despite bulking up to 268 pounds, Brandon Graham ran an impressive 4.69 at the Combine. He also posted 31 reps of 225. It’ll be very difficult for the Falcons to pass on him at No. 19.

    Futuresfootball.com had Graham at the #2 DE with JPP at number 3 – Bleacer report had Graham at #21 overall and JPP at #22 overall – one draft group actually listed both JPP and Graham at both OLB and DE and at DE had JPP at 2 and graham at 3 then reversed them for OLB – but again – in all cases – Derrick Morgan is listed as #1 DE in that draft and in some cases Carlos Dunlap sneaks up in there –

    now lets look at guard for 2011 Futursefootball #1 Guard – Danny Watkins – CBS football #2 Danny Watkins – Bleacher report #2 – the pattern seems to be if M Pouncey is listed as a G Watkins is #2 G – if Pouncey listed as center – Watkins #1 guard – Watkins was taken as the #2 G (Pouncey taken as a C/G by Miami – but aren’t they horrible and didn’t we just get assloads of sacks against them?)

  19. Not to bead a dead horse, but after looking over some notes leading into the 2010 Draft, The Top Rated DE’s were as follows

    #1) Derrick Morgan from Georgia Tech (drafted by Titans,off to quiet start)
    #2) B Graham from Michigan (Drafted by Eagles, injured)
    #3) C Dunlap from Florida (Drafted by Bengals in 2nd Round-Character issues and has turned out to be a damn good players thus far)
    #4) JP Paul- from South Florida (Drafted by Giants, having a great 2nd season after a slow Rookie Season)
    #5) Everson Griffin from USC (Drafted by the Vikings and a Rotational player at best and has had some off the field isssues)
    #6) Corey Wooten from Northwewestern (Drafted by the Bears, injured his rookie season and is a rotational player in his 2nd year)
    #7) EJ Wilson from UNC (Drafted by Seattle and is a rotational player
    #8) Alex Carrington from Arkansas St is a starter for the Bills and making some plays ..
    #9) Greg Hardy from Mississippi (drafted by the Panters and has had a very productive 2 Seasons after dropping in the Draft due to character issues.. Has 72 Tackles and 9 Sacks in his 1st 2 Seasons so far which is not bad)
    #10) Teo’ Neisham from Washington (Drafted by the Eagles after becoming the all Pac-10 Career Sack Leader who was too small and not stong enough to play at the line of scrimmage in the NFL.)

    Goes to show that it’s a crap-shoot.

  20. Give me a break..for every guy or mock draft that said JPP was a one year wonder or #2 or 3 there was one that said he was a beast and would turn out better in the pros than any other DE in the draft. He was not a diamond in the rough, he was up there on the boards at his position. BG to me was actually more of a woodley type of player who would be better in 3-4 system than ours…which makes me wonder why they drafted him even more….fact is this…the Eagles shouldn’t need mock drafts to tell them who to pick. That is their job to know and to get it RIGHT and they havn’t on the defensive side of the ball. Fact is when is the last time they drafted and coached up a stud on the defensive side of the ball?

    Again, my frustration isn’t with BG…I already mentioned he didn’t pick himself. Ill give him until next year to erupt like he says he will…hopefully he won’t just be another player talking big and not playing up to it because we already have a bunch of those guys here.

    My issue is with the FO and whoever the freaking talent evaluator is on the defensive side of the ball…again when is the last time they drafted a stud on defense?

    “If JPP was drafted by the Eagles, would he be playing as well, that’s no given either…” exactly Paulman, you see thats what proves the point that there needs to be some serious changes for next year.

  21. So just a general thought for human consumption – seen it with Casey Matthews, seen it with Graham – um.. what is it going to say for the future of rookies WANTING to come to Philly, if the word that starts getting out that the fans – most of which if you told to run one set of gassers would fall over – will treat you like shit, and feel it is their right because they are eagle fans – who is going to want to come play in Philly? Everyone is ass, the coaches are ass, if you get drafted you are ass and the coaches can’t draft, the FO is FU? Why would anyone want to play in Philly? LEts be honest – it ain’t sunny and 65 in mid-December –

    You know – have a slow start rookie year – can’t bring your family or GF to the Linc cause it is the fans right to hurl insults –

  22. To Greenfan,

    I had the Eagles standing pat with the #24 Selection and taking
    either Center Pouncy or CB McCourtey which I stated a few times back then.
    To be honest I never anticipated the Eagles moving up 11 spots, as most of us probably didn’t, so players like Safety E Thomas, DE JPP or OT A Davis would not have been on my radar since they would have been selected already by the 24th Selection.. ..
    If I did, then I woudl have said Safety E Thomas based on who was available)

  23. so Navy, you are preaching that we are to be forever patient and never say a word? I don’t buy it.

    Frankly I could care less what potential first round picks feel about philly fans, they don’t have a choice. They MUST go where they are picked (unless you pull an Elway or Manning).

    Bottom line…the FO has done a poor job with their 1st round picks. Not since McNabb has there been a player taken that could be mentioned as a yearly All-Pro pick. There draft is usually strong in 4th & 5th round “finds” that are able to be above average pro players.

  24. Pheags – See you want to be all tough, but you’re missing the point – that players feel the hate from Eagles fans. To my point the other day – that contributes to preventing the team from more success. If Graham, who was injured majorly in the infancy of his career, feels that the fans are hateful, how is he suppossed to care about the fans wanting a superbowl?

    You can puff out your chest and cry for ‘toughness’ all you want macho man, but wouldn’t it be better to help the team succeed?

    And god damnit, hindsight draft analysis defies sense, but somehow so many fools do it every year.

    Why cant people use their brains?

  25. Ok P-man…I actually believe that you have your predictions saved somewhere on your computer, so I’ll take your word for it.

    I remember that night, hearing that the birds moved up and thinking it was to take Thomas…hearing they took Graham and having to do a search to see who he was…then uttering some comment about a “fastball”….

  26. greenfan – players play better when they feel appreciated by the fans. It’s human nature. It’s psychology. It’s scientific fact. They place worse in harsh environments. Your ‘not caring’ about that is up to you – but it contributes to the team losing. You want your cake and to eat it to – for the team to win a superbowl and fans to be hateful and apathetic to the human beings playing the game at the same time.

  27. Just a sec Eroc…I think I need some clarification on the whole BG vs JPP debate…..you saaid:

    “Howie and the boys thought it was just nice that he had a gymnastics backround.Just like they thought Allen outta S.Florida could outplay a guy who made plays at a big school like Texas. ”

    So it was bad taking the guy with less experience (Allen) out of the small school (S Fla) and they shoulda taken the guy (that guy?) from a big school (Texas)

    but…

    It was also bad that they didn’t choose the guy with less experience (JPP) from the small school (Wake) and instead chose the guy with more experience (Graham) out of the big school (Michigan)

    Did I get that right?

    So all inexperienced players from small schools are bad (allen), UNLESS hindsight looks back and tells us that less experienced guys from small schools are good (JPP)

    and

    The experienced guys from big schools are good (guy from Texas) UNLESS hindsight tells that that experienced guys from big schools (Graham) are bad.

    I think I got your logic.

  28. To Grrenfan,

    I don’t save my posts, but most of the regualrs on here would proably remember some of the my Mock Drafts back in 2010 because most of them laughed at me and busted my stones for stating the Eagles to take a Center (Maurkice Pouncey) with a 1st Round Selection where I had him graded as the most NFL Ready Center in years and will probably end up a 10-12 Year Starter with multiple Pro-Bowls..
    I recall when watching the Draft unforld and the Deal was announced with the Bronocs about the Eagles moving up to to the 13th Spot, i would have bet the House that it was going to be Safety Eric Thomas, and I was very vocal and disappointed that they didn;t and even more disappointed that they made the trade to move up to begin with since it was a very deep draft at a lot of positions (OL/DL/Safety) and the Eagles traded away 2 3 rd Round picks to the Broncos which lead the Eagles to trade their 2nd Rounder to the Cowboys (who took ILB S Lee) and left the Eagles who were in great shape going into the draft will trading away 3 Selections from the Top #100 for 4-5 Selections in the 4th/5th Rounds (#125-#175th) so they lost of on 2-3 Potentially better players in my opinion.. I hated this Draft Strategy and the picks they eneded up with in 2010 .. (I did like NAte Allen in the 2nd and Kafka in the 4th, Cooper in the 5th and Coleman in the 7th but they really missed on not having those 3 original selections (1 in 2nd and 2 in the 3rd Round) that they traded away ..

  29. P-man…been on here for a whil…frankly you have multiple multiple mock drafts, so no doubt you could pull one out that would represent what you are saying. No problems here.

    Schiller…I do not advocate “hatred” and aggresion by the fans as a normal course…by expression of displeasure with a team, organization or player is the right of every fan….believe it or not schill, you or navy or dizzy or ..here is an old one…reggio are the rule maker for fan behavior….you have an opinion that a fan should only utter supportive words of encouragement regardless of a team or players performance…frankly that sounds like the role of a mother to her child…well most of the guys have mothers or loved ones to take care of that role…the role of the fan is to support his team how HE see’s fit….many believe that when a team is underperforming, vocal expression of displeasure is often needed to relay the message that things are not going well…to restate a previous comment, I still do not believe that cuddling these athletes, coaches and FO with rainbows and unicorns will get the best results….there was a reason that opposing teams hated coming into the VET to play…and if you ask the Eagles players who played there, they loved it even though it was a dump because of the vocal support of the fans…

  30. Schiller, Im sure your an alright dude and what I’m about to say regards to football, nothing personal. I think your the one missing the point.

    First off have you ever heard of something called adversity? I don’t know where you got your major in psychology but you know when one faces adversity or someone telling them they cant do something etc. its proven that they will do better to prove doubters wrong esp in sports. “It’s human nature. It’s psychology. It’s scientific fact”…man look at every athlete that has ever won a freakin championship…When they are asked what drove them to be that good its always some story of someone telling them they sucked or thought they were never good enough. see Brady, Rodgers, Jordan etc.

    If BG doesn’t become motivated from fans telling him off then he is not the type of player I want him on my favorite team at all.

    Second, you say “how is he suppose to care about the fans wanting a superbowl”…this is one of the most absurd things I have ever read. He is supposed to care because were the ones that pay his damn million dollar salary. We pay all of their salaries. Your whole cake theory is BS to me. Eagles fans jobs is to show up to the stadium which as far as I know the Linc is full year in and year out. Its not their job to cheer a team when their 5-8 in the worst division of football and who has underperformed on a season basis. The fans in this city have done their job by showing up to the games. The players and coaches have not. Period. As far as i kno, the only people who are actually having their cake are the players and coaches who continuously get paid millions to just underperform year in and year out.

    And even if he or other players dont care about the fans enough to go all out and win a Superbowl, i guess that means they shouldnt care at all and its alrright. I guess the contract they sign means nothing. I guess they have no obligations to their coaches, teammates, or even themselves to go 100 % for a superbowl

    Now you want to tell me how to act at an eagles game and tell me Im wrong for my toughness? Im sorry sir, but if im buying my own tix to the game with my own money, who in the hell do you or anybody else think they are to tell me how to boo or cheer during the games? (obviously im not one that agrees with violent acts) however if you make a terrible play or make a terrible call i will boo and tear you apart and noone else has a right to tell me not to.

    “And god damnit, hindsight draft analysis defies sense, but somehow so many fools do it every year”
    Guess what bro, hindsight is going to happen when you havn’t drafted a quality player on defense in how many years. Please tell me how long its been since we drafted just ONE freakin stud on defense….Obviously your not going to get them all but when your missing year after year and are basically batting ZERO on defensive players in the past years, hindsight is going to be brought up and the only fool is a fan who thinks its fine for that to happen. Im glad you were happy they moved up to draft BG, but im pretty sure the majority of eagles fans and their grandmothers thought it was going to atleast be Earl Thomas. Hell even after the trade was made and pick was in, Sal Pal even said before BG name was called up that the Eagles consensus seems to be that they moved up for Earl Thomas. But again, Eagles always trying to out smart everybody since that seems to work right? Im pretty sure hindsight on the draft isn’t brought up in regard to the Steelers and Packers to name a few.

    Geez man, I hope you have higher standards in life in general than you do for your football team.

  31. In last years Mock, (2010 Draft)

    1st Round #23 (DT M WIkerson from Temple)
    2nd Round #54 (G/T B Iljilana from Villanova)
    3rd Round #90 (OLB KJ Wright from Miss State)

    All 3 Would most likely been Starters and great fits for this Eagle Club..
    But that is water under the bridge at this point.. Enjoy..

  32. Greenfan and Pheags – two topics here – this is ‘what I preach’ – its a sport, a game, not life and death – get over it. We have a team, the eagles – we want them to win – I am pretty sure they try. It is very, very (put in 500 very) easy to sit around a bitch and whine and complain –

    does Graham not playing as well at JPP take food out of your kids mouth or make it so you get less sex from your wife (if you are so inclined) does it take money from your pocket? Does it cuase you bodily harm, then its a game – Graham is a person – shitting on him does what? Does it make his knee better? How is Casey Mathews doing since the ‘fans’ had something to say to her? Its time to grow up and realize life isn’t gonna always be a bowl of cherries man – draft picks will work out, draft picks won’t

    the honest to god thing that bugs the living fucking shit out of me – is give me a standard – give me guidleins on what constitues a good draft verse a bad draft – every one on here cherry picks information to show the FO is dysfunctuional or bad – yet what is the standard – then – I can compare that standard and see if the FO is really bad or actually slightly better then average –

    lik eevryone knows how bad Reid is with the challenge flag right – no wrong – Reid is actually in to top 15 coaches on getting calsl overturned – but when you live in a vacuum (or wit you head up your ass) you can’t see the forest becuase of the trees –

  33. BotGreenfan, I do not intend to tell other fans how to act and I never have. I also never said support them all the time. You think graham was reacting to fans saying something like ‘graham has not played as well as we hoped. his injury really setback his early career and its a shame because we all had such high expectations for him”. No, it was harsh and hurtful. There is pleny of middleground between what you charcterized mine and navy’s suggestion for fas’ reactions and what graham recievied. You know that right?00

    I agree about opposing players. Isn’t graham an eagle? Doesn’t that make a 100% differece? Why are you mixing eagles and opponents, that fs up your argument

  34. Graham was another one of those Andy picks that when announced, you looked at the TV in awe and thought “what the ****” …. myself and I know many others wanted Earl Thomas and JPP at #13….I didnt even see Graham as a 1st round pick let alone #13…. face it, Roseman is clueless and Reid is just as guilty. As I stated when he was drafted, Graham will NEVER be a productive NFL player!

  35. SpectPheages, appreciate your civility. But first, I never told you how to act. Never so dont pretend i did. Also, tell me this, how do waitresses, comedians, musicians etc.. respond to rude agressive comments from customers/audience? Who’s paying their checks?

    So actually, psychology etc shows that individuals respond differently to adversity in different ways depending on personality and context. But by your standards, the best thing for fans to do to help graham play well would be to shoot him with uzis, torture his mother and poop on his face when he comes up for air from waterboarding. Sound right?

    I never told you how to act. When did I? All I said was how many fans act/express themselves has negative consequences on players. Get it?

    And your frustration or our city’s collective frustration cancels out age old wisdom? Uh, no

  36. I actually feel somewhat bad for Graham, in the same way I do for Castillo. Graham was a great college player. Castillo was a good OL coach. Graham was taken with a high draft pick which by virtue puts a bullseye on your back, and asked to play more or less out-of-position by the team that drafted him. Castillo was put into the high profile role of DC, which is more or less out-of-position by the same team. To date, given the high profile of DC and 1st rd. pick, both have failed for whatever reason. Graham isnt going to balk at being a high 1st rd pick and Castillo isnt going to turn down a more prestigious position either and now both are targets of the dissappointed fans ire because the organization put them in these positions. My point is, this comes back to a failed philosophy on the Eagles, esp. on defense. The Eagles, I’m sure never even considered JPP in that draft, he dosent fit the mold. Hes 6’6 280 lbs. B. Graham is Trent Cole is J. Babin is J. Parker is D. Tapp = 6’1-6’2 250-260 good pass rusher, engulfed by the run game. I’ve yearned for players like JPP, C. Dunlap, Calias Campbell body types for years, hoping to strike a balance between solid pass rush and solid run D. The Eagles prefer the pass rush part and dont seem to care about the run. Eagles are built to get a big lead, make the other team have to pass and than T-off. Thats great, when you get a big lead. Problem is, if another team sticks to the run Birds are trouble. The fact that JPP is as good as his is, nobody really knows that coming out of the draft. My issue is the fast, smallish, non-physical element that the Eagles adhere to in talent evaluations that has not worked and makes them not even consider a player like JPP in the drafting process.

  37. good points Everz11

    Keep an eye of a couple of big guys avaialble next off-season
    In the Draft is Quinton Couples for UNC and is at 6-6 285 lbs and an athlete who reminds many Scouts of a a young Julius Peppers.. He will most likely
    be the 1st DE off the board and will probably be selected ianywhere in that 6th thru 10th range
    Another big sized player who is having a great All-Pro type os Season is the player you mentioned from the Cardinals Calais CAmpbell who wil be a free-Agent.. again it took Campbell a good 2 Years to find his groove in thNFL but he’s a heck of a player and will command top $$$ this Off-Season if he chooses to test Free-Agency.. I would imagine the Cardinals placing a Franchise Tag on him…

  38. jott1972 – then dude – you need to become a pro NFL scout – because I reviewed a bunch of draft sites today and EVERY SINGLE draft board had Graham in the top 25 players – and either in the top 3 DEs AND/OR top 2 OLBs. – Kudos to you – rare insight – just like the people who swore Danny Watkins was going to be abad pick even though he was rated the #1 gaurd (#2 if you incldued Pouncey) All Graham had done in High school and College was be an all american and lead the nation in tackles for loss – but you – with that keen eye saw that he was a bum – when he was beating the hell out of people at the senior bowl – you knew that the future first round OL pick was going easy –

  39. Everz – I did a long piece a while back about the ‘size’ of DEs in the NFL – and that crap you are spouting about DEs and size is pure bullshit – busted that myth a while back – JPP was EXACTLY 2 pounds, 32 ounces, almost 1kg heavier then Graham – go back and look at the combine scores for the two – then look at how Graham kicked JPPs ass in the weight room – I coudl jsut see if this were reversed and we did draft JPP and graham were kickin it in NY – it be like – look – another Dunlap – tall skinny bitch that can’t rep 225 20 times (Graham did 31) – 2 pounds – that’s it – everyone is looking back in hind sight going ‘I knew it’

  40. I think he’ll be a contributor here end of season.He’ll come one next year and start.Or be first dude off bench. Im booking that. Bottomline…i did want them to take Graham over Paul,but woulda been alright either way. The handsprings on the sports science made me feel like he would be a monstre. But im not paid to hit homeruns in the first round of a draft.

  41. so navy, based on your criteria, unless it directly affects my family job or sex life I should not have an opinion? Do I have that right?

    Well, guess what…part of being a fan IS having an opinion about your team. And part of what is great about being a fan, is being able to communicate to other fans.

    You said, “Its time to grow up and realize life isn’t gonna always be a bowl of cherries man – draft picks will work out, draft picks won’t”…by that same token, it is time to figure out that this head coach has maxed out his potential here….he is successful in many areas, but his time has past here…14 years is enough. Do you really think that there are not other high level executives in the NFL laughing about the fact that he made his OL coach a Defensive Coordinator…and then was suprised that things didn’t go smoothly?? How many years of poor clock managment do we have to endure before we are ALLOWED by the likes of you and Schiller to criticize him?? How many??

    It is like if ANYONE on here has the slightest negative thing to say is characterized as an overzealous maniac…truthfully i often stay away from this board because too many believe that if your opinion doesn’t fit within their view of the team or how a fan should “act”, then they are labeled as typical negadelphia blah, blah, blah. It’s ridiculous….this team has badly underperformed for the level of talent in many areas. The best they can hope for is .500. And people have the nerve to question why??

    Navy…I repect for many reasons..your service to our country…your experience blocking for Nap…your a smart dude..but even the smartest dude has to learn it from somewhere….I was always taught that God gave you 2 ears and 1 mouth because you are supposed to listen twice as much as you talk….maybe if you listened to alternative opinions more often it could lead to stronger arguments of your own.

    This team has not been lead properly since Reid’s kids went to jail. He lost power to upper management, and we have been on a slide ever since.
    Just like in Tampa and Indy…it is time for a change from a successful coach..a coach that could not take THIS team to the highest level.

  42. another undersized fastball, bum. JPP have size speed and strength, height.

    stanf him next to Graham and you’d know who had the Pro type upside. But nooooooooooo. Andy love hime some smurfs playing against Giants. That’s kinda weird for an oversized guy like Andy.

  43. Navy- if you read my post I never said “I told you so” about JPP- I think I wrote to the affect that there is no way to be certain how good a guy will be coming out of the draft and merely pointed out that the Eagles likely never considered JPP because of his size. I would argue that the “2 pounds, 32 ounces, almost 1kg” less that Graham weighed than JPP at the combine is likely his maxed out weight on a 6’1 frame, especially when Graham had to add weight to play out of position for the Eagles. I would think that you could project a 6’6 man to carry more weight as he matures without sacrificing his atheleticism. But the Eagles seem to struggle with projecting. Also, Mike Mamula did 26 reps of 225 lb on the bench press- the best for a DE in his class and we saw how that turned out. In my opinion, defensivley, the Eagles continue to draft (and miss) on the same type of player for the past several years.

  44. Everz sorry but it so pisses me off when people bring Mike Mamula into the discussion – we are not talking about Mike Mamula – we are talking about the bullshit statements of JPP being ‘big’ and Graham being ‘undersized’ when there was EXACTLY 2 pounds between them I was making a direct comparison betwen two people – not talking about a guy making a super big leap in the draft because he was a workout wonder – please, try to show me we can have a basic conversation without some assnine useless information coming into play – Graham had a better college career – was more heraldd coming out of college and was MCUH stranger then JPP – see a comparison between two people and was EXACTLY 2 pounds ‘undersized’ and then again – change the standard – ‘as he matures’ yet, we won’t give Graham time to mature – the mighty GCOBB shuffle – keep changing the criteria of the discussion –

    SOngs your the only bum on this site

  45. Greenfan -you are totally and utterly missing the point – please try and follow – let me use a military example – I served when Reagan was Pres and everyone in the military LOVED the man – it was a great thing. I served under the first Bush and again – beloved – believe it or not, most military are conservative – Clinton was NOT that popular – he was one record as saying and doing many things folks in the military didn’t like – each and every person has the RIGHT to have an opinion, its how you chose to EXPRESS that opinion that makes all the difference. It was fine to EXPRESS admiration for Reagan and Bush 1 – it was absolutley unacceptable to express anything less then respect for Clinton – you didn’t have to clap as loud, you didn’t have to stand as fast – but damn – you better not boo or hiss or refuse to stand -I guess I want to use words like respect, civilty, decency – it is perfectly acceptable to have a negative opinion – but do you have to make an ass out of yourself, make up false information, take every achievement and tarnish it, becuase you are not happy a sports team is not winning?

    Now – right now you are unhappy and you have your opinions – god bless you for those – it is how you chose to EXPRESS those opinons that I am commenting on. I for one thing it is absolutley useless to bash a team or hate on a team or scream about changes on a team, when the season is till on going and it is clear that dog ain’t gonna hunt. Now if you chose to turn off the TV, read a book, go for a walk – rock on. Really pissed – wrote a civil letter to the owner – do not renew tix – whetever
    Isn’t it funny that you and I both agree it is time to move in a new direction after this season as far as the head coach goes – the difference is in how we EXPRESS it. I do not feel it is my right to act like an asshole under the guise of being ‘passionate’ sorry, I see too many ‘passionate’ parents at kids games expressing the ‘right to free speech’ and ‘right to an opinion’ at coaches, refs and worse – their own kids. This is supposed to be entertainment, enjoyment, an event.. 1 team wins, 1 team loses (99% of the time)

    Do I think high level execs are laughing – no – I don’t think they give a shit – those that are worse then Philly are too worried about themselves, those better then Philly are more worried about having to beat GB or Baltimore or NE or NO – they ain’t got time or effort to waste on Philly ‘News Flash’ Philly is NOT the center of the universe – just another made up story line to try and sell papers –

    as far as being ALLOWED to do anything – I am sorry – do I have the ability to block your access? Delete your comments? Then it would appear that unless the definition of ALLOWED has changed – you are ALLOWED to post what you want – just as I am allowed to 1) have an opinion, 2) express that opinion and 3) respond to other peoples comments!

    So nothing in your opinions is wrong – I do not like how you ‘express’ it – I do not think it is productive nor do I think it in any way is fan like or designed to help the team – sorry dude – justmy opinion!

  46. Green I just re-read – my comments were meant in ‘generality’ with all posters – not directly at you – and yes, I do realize i am frequently uncivil and mean spirited – but never at the Birds – just the Dbags that rag on them!

  47. Schiller, I don’t really think that analogy you just threw out there made any sense. Were talking about sports. Way to exaggerate with the uzis, torture, and poop but no I never mentioned or meant anything like that and you know it. Made me laugh a lil tho. I simply mentioned that when it comes to championship athletes, some of the greats have talked about how being faced with adversity, or people telling telling them their not good enough, has been a cornerstone in their success. Its what has driven them to be great. I’ve never heard Jordan, Kobe or Brady mention being pampered by fans when they struggled at times as reasons they are where they are today. But I guess thats the way you think championship winning players are born.

    Obviously, there are some players that can’t handle it which makes them react different afterwards…so your right about that. So far it seems like BG is one of those who couldn’t even handle a couple of hecklers on twitter or casey mathews who had to lash out at the fans within 5 min of being here like hes somebody special. I’d rather have my favorite team made up of the prior which I’m sure you would as well…fact is we don’t which is evident by them setting like what an NFL record blown leads in games at home i believe this year. These players and coaches simply can’t get it done when it matters most which is proven by their pathetic record which means they deserve to be booed as much a fans rightfully choose to do so.

    Even though you don’t exactly tell others how to act if somebody calls out a player or coach its completely reprehensible to you like were savage animals…Then on top of that you contribute us to the players not doing their job in failing year after year to win a superbowl like were getting the paychecks. Thats BS man. Really if these players/coaches/FO need to strive that low to find that as an excuse of why they fall short every year then their in the wrong business in life. Im told im a fool for bringing up hindsight when it comes to the draft? Like i said hindsight in he draft would never be brought up on the defensive side of the ball if the eagles had just drfated say maybe just ONE stud on defense in the past couple years…whats the standard for a good draft…How about just ONE quality defensive above average stud every 1 or 2 years…is that really asking too much. If anything that standard is pathetic but based on what the Eagles have done recently I don’t think they are capable of anything more.

  48. Where is the surprise in all of this! He is another, in the infinity line of undersized & out of place players, in Square peg in round hole Reid’s resume! Most of bitched the day after the draft, when they didn’t take Earl Thomas or Pierre-Paul in the draft. He is a 3-4 outside linebacker & almost every analyst & front office guy said it. But not this front office. They know better! They are innovative!

  49. I bet 80% of the Posters here never ven heard of J Pierre-Paul before this Season… You guys crack me up…

  50. BS Navy. It is pretty plain to see that you don’t like a contrary opinion. Frankly, the “passion” that you exude putting down those who disagree, is equal to or greater then that with which the others are …the people that you don’t like how they “express” themselves. Sorry that you don’t like the style…I guess you shouldn’t have fought so hard to keep us free and maybe the dictator in charge would agree with your point of view.

  51. Nah P-man…theye was plenty of talk about JPP around and right after the 2010 draft. I will admit that you can pull names of guys from East Bum F*** State better then most here, but 80%? C’mon man!

  52. I’ll wait until I see a full season from Graham before I judge him. If he gets hurt again, I won’t consider him a bum…..just injury prone……and there really is no difference between the two.

  53. Ok Greenfan, maybe 50% then,. there was no doubt that JPP was on many peoples radar due to his raw athletic ability and upside but he still was considered a a high-risk/high reward Selection for a Top 15 Pick by most NFL Scouts/Draft gurus simply due his lack of game experience at the Division I level where he only played about 10-11 Games for SOuth Florida so there was not a consistent play record on his resume.. Either way, back to my original premise is that th Giants develop DL as well as any team in the NFL which is hard to argue about, and the Eagles conversely have not done a very good job in developing DL.. take Trent Cole out of the mix, who else have the Eagles drafted and developed to be a productive DL (maybe Corey Simon too) but look at McDougle,Patterson,Bunkley,Laws,Graham,B Smith, in recent Seasons, I would think it’s fair to say they have all under-performed wouldn’t you, meanwhile the Giants keep cranking out Pro_Bowl type of DL like Tuck,Umenyuri,JPP,Tolleson,DT’s Joseph, Canty.. ..

  54. @P-man….singing to the choir….we move up in the draft to take a successful, albeit, smaller DL only to turn him over to Rory Seagrest….there is your problem right there!!

  55. Navy- I agree that Graham had a fantastic college career and I acknowledged that in my original post. Mike Mamula was merely me pointing out that combine numbers and bench press reps (as you pointed out) rarely translate into who is a better football player. The combine is Hocus Pocus BS. I stand by the fact that JPP is 6’5 or 6’6 which is 4 inches taller than Graham and one year younger and that over time he would project to be a physically bigger man. This would seem to be accurate, whereas two years (gave Graham time to mature) into their careers, JPP is now listed as 278 and Graham at 268 maxed out (10 pounds). I dont hate Graham, I dont love JPP- my only point was JPP does not fit the mold of typical Eagle DE due to his size (height or weight). The bigger issue for me was that the Eagles desperatley needed a safety in that draft and had several to choose from. Instead, they chose Graham who was projected by most pundits to be 3-4 outside LB and not a 4-3 DE. I don’t think it can even be argued that the organizations talent evaluations in the last several years (esp defensively) have been terrible. My fear is that with the same people in charge and same philosphy, they will butcher a top 10 pick this year.

  56. Green – what do you say we call a truce on this one and agree to disagree – fair enough – each got the chance to express opinions and we move on? (pretend you here the snoopy-red baron christmas song in the back ground!)

  57. I wll give Brandon Graham next season to see how he develops..
    I have mentioned many times that physically, he has the tools to be a similar player as Trent Cole/Derrck Beugess.. I am not sold on his mental toughness as yet so let’s see how he battles back from this injury and overcome adversity..
    The one hugh area I am still concerned about, is his lack of cardio-vascular condition… WHen you watch him play, I don’t believe I have ever seen a Professional Athlete get so winded so fast as he does.. It’s as if he hyper-ventilates and can’t get oxegyn into his body properly.. I would like some of you to watch for this and to see what I see in his play.. and that’s like 2-3 playes and then off to the sideline because he’s pooped out already.. Mayve he has some bronchial/breathing condition, or is too hyped up emotionally which makes his breathing lock up on him, but take close notice on him next time he’s on the field and either way, he needs to improve his conditioning if he is going to be a productive NFL DE.. (I still say and actually stated when he was drafted that he would be a 30 Snap a game player and be a rotational player at best) and not the kind of productions you expect for the 13th Overall pick

  58. Pheages – I hear you man, and I think we’re doing a good job of having a civilized arguement here.

    Yeah, I was definitely exagerrating and joking around a bit there. But my point stands – yes there’s some examples of athletes drawing strength from overcoming adversity. But that does not mean that contributing additional adversity is necessarily helpful. It’s one thing for an athlete to retrospectively acknowledge the growth through hard times, but another to make it worse before they’ve triumphed beyond it! How’s that – better way of expressing my point?

    But Pheages, do you really think the players aren’t striving to win a superbowl? I think that’s ridiculous. On the same stance – you really think that when Graham gets blocked or beaten, when vick throws an INT, when Avant drops a pass etc.etc.etc. they’re clueless as to whether that’s a good or bad thing? you think they need the fans to let them know? HELL NO. They are aware of their mistakes when they make them and even more aware when they are aggregious mistakes. At that point, the boos…etc.. HURT, they don’t HELP the situation. It’s harmful overkill. That’s my point.

  59. @ Schill….you say”On the same stance – you really think that when Graham gets blocked or beaten, when vick throws an INT, when Avant drops a pass etc.etc.etc. they’re clueless as to whether that’s a good or bad thing? you think they need the fans to let them know? HELL NO. They are aware of their mistakes when they make them and even more aware when they are aggregious mistakes. At that point, the boos…etc.. HURT, they don’t HELP the situation. It’s harmful overkill. That’s my point.”

    So your point is to have the fans be silent…no feedback, because these players and coaches know when they are doing good or bad? That is alot of money that they are asking the fans to pay just to quietly watch.

    It is obvious we disagree. As a metaphore, steel is a material that is strongest when “work hardened” or “heat treated”. I believe that if players operate in a system that filters out all negative feedback, it can begin to “spin” things within the walls of the organization that things are going in the right direction….if only a few things went our way…and will continue to underperform because there is no pressure to do better. Many players and coaches are self motivated (to get to this level they are obviously gifted and not afraid to work hard), but there is a place for recognizing the expectations of a fanbase that is responsible for the popularity of the team and revenue source for all to make a better than average salary.

  60. Green I hear you. I disagree however that the spin we get through the media and general public is the same thing the coaches tell the players – come on man!

    I’m not suggesting the fans are silent in their immediate reactions. Its the lingering negativity and hate that I think is detrimental to the team’s success. Repeated extreme negative reinforcement becomes abusive.

    You can boo the play, and then move on, but you and I both know that many many Eagles fans go far beyond that. So again, you’re accounting for 0 grey area in between silence and what many fans do – be real man

  61. Your right schill, I took it to an extreme…but in an effort to refute your stereotype of ALL fans who believe that there are things wrong with the way this team is run, coached and has preformed.
    There are areas in the middle..yes, we all know the fans that will boo the Star Spangled Banner..but you have illustrated that there are also fans that believe that the organization can do NO WRONG, and anyone who believes different should be shouted down and their loyalty to the team questioned. Yes…there are extremes on both sides.

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