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Eagles Season Will Come Down To Andy Reid And Michael Vick

Like it or not the greatness in the NFL is judged by a team’s performance in close games. In Philadelphia this is especially true.  The main reason the Eagles have been in the hunt but lack a Super Bowl ring throughout the Andy Reid era is directly related to the team’s performance in the close games.

In the past four seasons the Eagles are 7-18-1 in games decided by one score or less (includes playoffs). Based on Donovan McNabb’s post Eagles performance many Eagles fans would consider Michael Vick an upgrade to Donovan, however in close games nothing changed. In McNabb’s final two seasons as an Eagle he was 3-9-1 in games decided by one score or less, while Vick has gone 3-7 in  one score games he started and finished.
There are other variables such as poor performance from the defense, dropped passes, and fumbles that have lead to the Eagles one score game debacles, however, those same obstacles Super Bowl winning quarterbacks have over came to produce a winning record in crunch time.
In the last five seasons not one team which has one Super Bowl has had a starting quarterback with a losing record in close games. When Vick is compared to what Super Bowl winners have done in close games in the last two years, the numbers show Vick is an average NFL quarterback when it matters most.
Since the start of 2010 the win loss records of quarterbacks who have won a Super Bowl in one score games is as follows, Rodgers:12-6 Manning:10-3 Roethlisberger:12-5 Brady: 9-5 Brees 9-6 even Jets backup quarterback Tim Tebow managed to go 8-2, while Vick was 3-7. Tebow may have had a better defense while in Denver, but the Eagles weapons on offense are far superior to Tebow’s.
The Eagles may have had their best draft since Andy Reid took over in 1999, and the team made the best possible effort to fill in the holes the that killed the team’s playoff hopes in 2011, but if a fan is to look at this team objectively, what did the team do the fix its 4th quarter issues that has plagued the team in recent history?
Personal wise was there much the team could do? Based on the combined numbers of both Donovan McNabb and Michael Vick in close games, is that the reflection of two quarterbacks who cannot win close games, or a coach who cannot manage a game down the stretch? Is the 2012 off-season going to be the second straight year in which fans are blinded by the national media wowing over personal moves and forget a team that cannot win a close game, will not win a Super Bowl?
Four of the Eagles first six games are against playoff teams from 2011. The Lions, Ravens, Giants, and Steelers combined to go 22-7 in close games (Includes playoffs). All four teams had winning records in close games. Is there one Eagles fan out there who thinks the Eagles are going to blow out any of those 4 teams in 2012?  All four games will be close and based on Michael Vick, and especially Andy Reid’s track record in one score games, isn’t it fair to say the Eagles will be lucky to be 3-3 after the first six games?
Eagles fans must look at the big picture before getting their hopes up for this team to win a division title let alone a Super Bowl in 2012. The team improved in some key areas, but at the end of the day how the quarterback and coach perform in close games will make or break the 2012 season.
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Posted by on May 15 2012. Filed under BREAKING NEWS, Eagles, General News, News. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

110 Comments for “Eagles Season Will Come Down To Andy Reid And Michael Vick”

  1. You columnist want so bad for Andy and Mike to not succeed it makes me sick. It would be understandable if you had won a SB previous to Vick arriving, but now you want to blame every game on him. What a bunch of junk. As I recall last year we had a 10 point lead going into the 4th quarter of falcon’s game and the defense could not stop anyone. We had a 20-3 lead in the 49ers game and could not keep the lead. We had a lead in the Giants game (1st game) and lost the lead. If the defense had just held in one of these games. The Giants would not have been in the play-offs. But I guess Vick needs to play defense. It is on this whole team to play well, not just Vick and we already know you fools want Andy out of Philly. Actually philly does not deserve a SB, but this team does. I hate all you hacks that can’t support your team.

  2. WOW!

    I feel you JMt.

  3. Although, I agree that the Eagles Season Will Come Down To Andy Reid And Michael Vick, NO DUH, OBVIOUSLY, you weren’t very clear on what losing / winning by one score means. Is it 7 pts, 6 pts, 3 pts, WHAT!? Be a little more clearer next time, when you attempt to try & write an article on things everyone knows already. Reid is in a lame duck, do or die, coaching year, Vick is sinking & swimming with Reid (SB or bust), & McFlubb, was an underachieving, choke artist, who never won us the Big one. Stop beating a dead horse, nobody gives a flaming pile of crap about McFlubb, anymore. He is a non-factor, non-story, & NO I DON’T WANT HIM AS VICK’S BACKUP, for all of the geniuses, who inevitably will try to tout that nauseating nonsense. Let’s get through OTA’s & pre-season, before you start saying the season is over already. JEESH, & I thought I was impatient & negative about the Birds. Jerry, with all do respect, you write some of the most head scratching, mind boggling, ill-timed, ill-advised, agenda laced articles, that I’ve ever seen. You have some goofy timing with your stuff, dude. I may rip the hell out of my teams, but I do it out my love for them & for them getting better, & the truths & problems I see in the way they’re run. You just have issues & agenda’s with certain people, & don’t hide it. Although I think Reid should have been fired when McFlubb was traded, I have nothing against him personally & give him all of the credit in the world for rebuilding us, from a $#!t team in the 90′s to a legit SB contender. McNabb arguably was/ is the best QB in our history, whether he was a choke or not. I agree about Vick though. He has always been an overrated, over-hyped, done-nothing loser, throughout his entire career. I highly doubt we ever win with him.

  4. Dcar, show the same patience with the phils my friend, good times on the horizon, and I agree with the author, at the end of the day, it matters who is clutch , who has it, who you know will win it, you knew Eli would, Montana would, elway would, Vick ?……. This is a good article but speaking to a deaf audience

  5. Ultimately, it comes down to the play of the quarterback, especially in this era of pass happy football, make all the excuses you want, blame the defense, say all the cliches, it’s a team game, but if Eli manning, Joe Montana , Steve young, name all the other quarterbacks who lead their team to victory on the last drive, after all else faltered, when the defense gave out, when the coach blundered, when the wideout dropped the ball, they all said , no, put it on me, I am the one, I will lead to victory, and you knew they would.

    Do we have this quarterback with Michael Vick?

  6. Jakedog all them teams you mention their defense also made plays. You forget that even though Eli Manning made plays at times. in 7 games he didnt hence the 9-7 record. His friggin defense shut down the Patriots, Packers and Falcons, lets not get it twisted. Yes he still made plays but because of his defense he could take chances, because of his defense he only had to make a few plays instead of alot of plays. Against the 49ers he made alot of plays, I will give him that. But having a competent defense can only help dont ya think? Im not saying Eli doesnt deserve his due(which he does) but the defense helps ALOT.

  7. The excuses end in 2012, it’s time to strap it on and play ball..
    from Coach AR & MM and Castillo to the star name players like Vick, D-Jax,Asmo, T Cole, etc,etc… It’s a players game and the Eagles best players must step up collectively if they are to compete for a Championship.. End of Story..

  8. LOL….JMT, Dag, Paulman and even DCAR (excluding his Vick comments)…that was real talk right there! you can tell who are knowledgeable fans and who aren’t…

  9. This team was 8-8 last year, and didn’t make the playoffs…who have not won a playoff game since the 2008-09 season……why wouldn’t the head coach be under the gun to have a successful season?
    Nobody is saying it is SB or you’re fired, but after 14 years of being here and the state that the team has been in for the past 4-5 years, I would bet that even Andy Reid would agree that this is as important year for his as he has had during his time in Philly.
    As far as Vick, just as any star QB on an underperforming team, he will get alot of focus. You think that Flacco isn’t hearing the same things in Baltimore? Well he is, and so are many other QB’s on non-playoff teams, so there is really no story here, just stating the obvious.

  10. Here we go again with these articles about Vick and Reid, they have to win the Superbowl or they have to go LOL that’s a bunch of bull. It takes more than Vick and Reid to win games, it actually takes the entire team. But for some reason you folks want to lay the all the responsibility on just one member of the team and forget about all the other players, you want to lay the responsibility of one coach instead of all the coaches. Its a team game not a Reid or Vick game, the entire team will have to step up. Dropping balls, penalties, fumbles, the defense giving up leads etc., were not all done by Vick, none were done by Reid. It really sounds like a lot of you don’t like Reid or Vick, so that is where you lay the blame, instead of laying the blame where it should be, which is on all of the players, not just the ones you don’t like. Vick is going into his second year as a starter (first year with full offseason programs) and its a must for him. I have said this before and I will say it again, I don’t think there is any qb out there right now, who could be out of the league for three years and have the comeback Vick has had, no one expected him to have a comeback at all let alone be a starter. Everyone wants to talk about the great year Shady had, and he did have a great year, but how the hell do you think he got the ball?

    Bottom line for the most part some of you folks including the author of these articles are just whiners, you will complain about anything, the season hasn’t even started but most of you have, with your complaining. Maybe the Eagles should have kept Kevin Kolb, I guess had that happened you would be saying the Eagles were rebuilding. Give the season a chance to start before you do, don’t be afraid you won’t have anything to whine about, I’m sure you’ll find something, even if they win the Superbowl, you’ll find something to whine about.

    @DCar, you talk out of both sides of your mouth, you support the team in one breath and in that same breath you tear down the QB, Vick is a loser, never won anything, I guess going to the probowl 4 times is nothing, beating, GB in GB (almost by himself) is nothing, winning Comeback player of the year is nothing, not to mention all the other awards he recieved in 2010 is nothing, but with all of that in your mind he’s a loser………………..yeah right.

  11. peace – well said – its a team game – all 53 players and the enitre coaching staff should feel like thier jobs are on the line -

    I was surprised when the author discussed this line:

    There are other variables such as poor performance from the defense, dropped passes, and fumbles that have lead to the Eagles one score game debacles, however, those same obstacles Super Bowl winning quarterbacks have over came to produce a winning record in crunch time.

    really – if I remember right there were two VERY key plays int he SB last year – on one, Wes welker broke free and Brady threw just slightly behind him – but in my opinion – Wes Welker catches that ball 99 out of 100 times – this one he didn’t….

    ELi Manning launches a nive throw down the sideline, very close to the sideline where MAnningham makes a sweet catch (how many times have you seen that – Big BEn in the back corner – Tyree on the helmet)

    so Eli is better then Tom becuase MArio caught the ball??? No its a team game – the Giants beat the PAts because the giants caught the ball… TEAM game..

  12. @peace….”Everyone wants to talk about the great year Shady had, and he did have a great year, but how the hell do you think he got the ball?”

    Are you telling me that you want people to recognize that Vick made good handoffs? Classic….LOL….that is really funny.

    QB’s in the NFL are always faced with criticism….MV has already stated that he knows that he needs to cut down on the turnovers from last year, and play in a style that will keep him healthy. Most fans on here recognize that the play of the OL has a great effect on both of those things, and that early in last season the OL had yet to gel. Yes it is a team game, but QBs always get more credit for wins and too much blame for loses…that is a fact, even if it may not always be fair.

    Hand-off’s….we are talking ’bout Hand-offs …not passes…Hand-off’s

  13. @greenfan, I know where you’re going with your response, but hey it ain’t working. My comment wasn’t just about Vick, however that is all you seem to take from it. Classic….LOL that is really funny………..try again.

  14. @navyeaglefan, thank you, my point exactly.

  15. I can’t talk about this topic anymore, personally I think GCOBB is low on site hits so they’ll drudge up any Mike Vick/Andy Reid criticism article to get more visitors. I don’t care what stats any author or poster lists regarding Reid and Vick because I’ve still got both of their backs. And while quite is kept, I know many of the people on this site (including the authors) want this team to fail mainly because Vick is QB and partially because Reid is HC. Keep hating and being negative that’s fine with me. I honestly think GCOBB is one of the most negative Eagles “Fan” sites on the net. I rarely see anything positive posted about this team or its leadership and it’s depressing. The QB sucks, the coach stinks, the new LB is too short, yada yada yada. I want the Eagles to win a SB just as bad as any fan so that I can got to the rest of the division fans and say “how ya like me now bitches!!!” You guys can be negative all you want but there are many positives to look forward to for next season. Instead of letting the media dictate how you feel about this team and its leadership go back and watch the games for yourselves. NFL rewind costs $20 for a month and you can watch all the games from 2009 to the present.

    @greenfan… “Hand-off’s….we are talking ’bout Hand-offs …not passes…Hand-off’s” That was hilarious!!!

    I’m excited about 2012 and can’t wait! FLY EAGLES FLY da dada dada da da……

  16. peace, the truth, isn’t talking out both sides of my mouth. Pro bowls don’t mean $#!T! It’s a popularity contest. Give me a freaking break. He has NEVER won anything & never has risen his teams, anywhere of significance in the playoffs. He won 2 wildcard games, with ZERO, of any kind of Champions. Don’t get me wrong, I respect his talent, but he is nothing but a product of ESPN hype & a Madden video game character. He never has done squat. Don’t let your man-love for him, cloud your judgement. Remember I’m not Vinnie & my judgement isn’t clouded, nor biased & I don’t hate the man. Just stating the facts, bruh.

  17. @lionsden, you could not have said that better. You’re right GCOBB is the most negative site as it relates to the Eagles. GCOBB for some reason forgets he played with the Eagles as well, they didn’t win a Superbowl when he played, (I wonder why) but yet he is always critical of the players and coaches, because of their lack of winning the big one. This site uses the names Michael Vick and Andy Reid to get readers and haters, they know without using those names they will get neither.

  18. so why are you on here peace…if it is so bad??…. masochist?

  19. @DCar, if you were stating facts you wouldn’t have called the man a loser, in addition to saying he hasn’t won anything. Fact is had the defense and other players stepped up more than likely the Eagles would have made the playoffs, that’s a fact. Don’t let your man-hate for him cloud your judgement. Remember I wasn’t talking about one player I was talking about the entire team. It takes a team, that’s another fact, bruh.

  20. On a side note,
    Can we make sure that no articles ever mention Tim Tebow, Thank you…

  21. @greenfan, I’m here because I want to be, I’m here because just like you I have a right to my opinion whether you like it or not….Granted I’m not here on every article, everyday like you, I just don’t have that kind of time, however when I want to be here I will do that………Alright

  22. You sound like my 17 year old daughter peace…….cause I want to, blah, blah, blah.

    If it is as bad as you say, delete the link. We can all certainly get by without having to read a complaint from peaceful1.

    My take on this site is that the articles are so-so…I tend to get my information from other sites…but the comments and talk are usually full of information and always from an eagles fan perspective…not necessarily a “step-ford” eagles fan, but from different types of fans who have different opinions…this is certainly not a cheerleaders site, but a site full of fans who want the best for the team.

  23. @greenfan, I didn’t take time to read your entire comment the first sentence was enough for me. I hope your 17 year old daughter doesn’t whine as much as you.

  24. The problem is, and always has been, the defense. The defense has never been good enough. AR is a poor clock manager and McNabb/Vick are not clutch performers, but the defense has been more to blame for the Eagles failures.

  25. @greenfan Since when do you and your buddies become the freedom of speech police. He or she has a right to that opinion. You negative people are not real Eagles fans. Whoever the Jeremy Brennan is looks like he went through Philly.com and copied and past some of Les Bowen and Jeff McLane’s articles. I would like to know what SB has philly one in the past to compare what Reid and Vick are doing or will do this year? I would like to know what other coach has taken the Eagles to a SB for you losers to come on here and attack Reid, Vick and any fan who has a positive outlook on anything the Eagles are doing to get better? If you are a Giant fan stop hiding in the closet pretending to be a Eagles fan with all this negative mess. This team has as much chance as any to win a SB. I am so glad the players do not listen to this garbage. Hell they get more support on the road than they do at home. So why don’t you negative nellies become a Cowgirl fan, midget fan or even a deadskin fan. One thing for sure you sure as hell are not coaches or players and neither is Jeremy Brennan. You would think they would come up with more orginial things to right. Like evaluating the schedule. The national ,media sees the Eagles as the front runners but of course these loser mentality local yocals can’t see at all. When the Eagles do win the SB, these nuts will say it is because somebody had a down year. This is the worse media I have ever seen in my life and so called fans to. I don’t give a hoot what you say about me you losers. I am a Eagles fan and whatever they do I will root for them. That is what REAL fans do. The season has not even begun and they sick fools are still stuck in the past. @Peac112 say what you want F these losers with their loser mentality, Last time I checked it is a team game, not a one man game ask all those qbs up there that you put on this article Big Ben, Brees, Rogers Tebow SMH. did any of them win the SB last year. STFU and wait until the season is over before you talk about the Eagles, we all know if you had your wish Kolb would still be here running backwards and you would not have a problem because he is a golden boy. It would be everyone else fault if the Eagles did not win but Kolb. Come out of the closet and tell the truth. You want a white qb. Well you had them in the past, where is your SB ring?

  26. peace, maybe the word loser, was kind of harsh, but what would you call someone who has constantly won nothing, failed to raise/ lead his teams to greatness, nor the next level, has done nothing to correct his faults, & is always hurt? STUBBORN, OVERRATED, OVERHYPED, NOT A GOOD QB, NOT A CHAMPION? Maybe those are better words for him. BTW, I don’t hate anyone. Alot of you guys use that word HATE a little too loosely on here. Just because some of us aren’t pom- pom waving step-fords, & choose to tell it like it is, & you don’t like it, doesn’t give anyone the right to falsely label us as haters. If I was a hater, I wouldn’t give a f^#@ about any of them. But you rock-heads can’t comprehend that, or look/ see without wearing your rose colored glasses. Remember, nobody is exempt to criticisms, or being ripped, even if they are my beloved home teams.

  27. WTF are you talking about jmt?

    I asked peace why would he be on here if the site was so terrible, and now I am infringing on his 1st amendment right to free speech? You are reaching jmt.

    Also, you accuse me of being racists and wanting a white qb. Where do you see any coment that I have EVER made regarding my desire for a white qb. I can answer that….you won’t fine that, because it isn’t true and such a comment does not exist. If you actually read my comments in this string, you will see that I have no issue with MV, and stated that many of his early season turnovers could be attributed to lack of continuity of the OL. But instead you try and marginalize my comments by throwing out an un-warranted race card. Pathetic.

    I said it above and I will say it again, qb’s in the NFL are ALL the target of great praise and great criticism….not all deserved, but they all pretty much understand that it comes with the territory.

  28. I think we can agree that we are all Eagle fans and want them to win a Championship and I know I can be overly critical, negative and sometimes just plain immature and stupid with some of my comments.. I do have a tendancy to over-analyze things which at times as a Fan, can be informative,funny,or plain stupid, but as a Life-long Fan since the early 70′s I will call them as I see them… I do try to stay away from the petty-name calling and am making a conscious effort to toning down the negativity…
    I also think many of us can agree that this off-season has been a very good one this far with smart deliberate signing of key players, an excellent Draft (on paper) and a level of a worman-like attitude of Coach AR and his entire Staff.. Do they Eagles have Pro-bowlers at every position and have no holes to improve, of course they don’t and I am not sure any team in the NFL can say they are 100% stacked at every position on their teams.. There does come a time with the younger players who were Drafted in 2009.2010,2011 have to step up and play their roles that they were Drafted and groomed to do.. This Team has a calm,confident feel and look about it with an infusion of smart, energetic and some very talented players.. I believe the Coaching Staff from Top to Bottom is much improved and finally on the same page as a Coachign Staff so the foundation is built, now it’s time to go out and play some football and may the best players win th starting positons and make the squad.. This is the most i’ve been excited to see the Eagles start Camp in I can’t tell you how long… last year was an freak year with the hold-out, craxy free-agent signings and an almost new Coaching staff and I never fot the feeling that everyone from GM Roseman, to Coach AR and his staff were on the same page for wahtever reason.. I am expecting big things from this Eagles 2012 Team…

  29. jmt, first off learn your punctuation. 2nd, if you read my initial post, I ripped Jerry for this $#!T article. 3rd, I can’t stand any other teams, but my local 4. 4th, Racist much? 5th, I’m half Black, so your race card is ignorant & a moot point, Kolb blows. 6th, you are telling us not to be freedom of speech police, but hypocritically did the same as green. Finally, read my prior post for enlightenment.

  30. @greenfan, when I did I say this site was terrible, fact is greenfan I never used the word terrible at all. Get your facts straight.

  31. green, the problem on here is there are too many ignorant, tools on here that lack reading comhension, common sense, & understanding of what they are reading, so they make $#!t up with their hidden agendas, & racism, because someone rips their false heros. Where race factors into any of this is, I don’t know? It’s pathetic ignorance, & laughable.

  32. DCar…good points. The people who act like you slapped their mom when you criticize the Eagles are very annoying. Everyone has the right to their opinion and people need to stop taking things so personally.
    A lot of people on here get real emotional about Vick because they somehow feel the criticism is racial in nature. They feel this strong kindred with Vick as a regular AA guy that does regular AA things and makes regular AA mistakes. They feel like he is one of them and not some typical pampered over-paid athlete who gets money and looks down his nose at other AAs. Thats how they perceive Donovan. He is not “down.” But Vick is just a regular guy and they support him blindly and faithfully. He seems to represent something some of us do not really understand.

  33. @ peace….you said:

    “You’re right GCOBB is the most negative site as it relates to the Eagles.”

    sounds pretty terrible to me.

  34. Couldn’t agree more with your last statement DCar. Agree.

  35. Again I will say it where is your SB ring from your previous team, pre Reid? Reid has a SB ring in case you did not know. You haters crawl from under rocks as soon as you see Vick/Reids names. The hack who wrote this garbage knows it that is why they write this negative mess just for people like @greenfan.

  36. jbird, all power to them, for who they root for, but I want a F^#@ING SB & I don’t care if an exchange student from Tiawan, QB’s us to it. I don’t blindly follow anyone, nor give anyone a pass on criticisms, whether they are black, white, purple, or Hulk green. But ignorant racists, can’t look past their own hate, & biases to even consider that. I’m black, Italian & Cherokee, so I don’t have any biases, nor preferences.

  37. jmt, WTF, are you smoking, or drinking. WTF, does Reids SB ring have to do with anything. Reid has a SB ring as GB qb coach. He’s been here since 99 & won stugots. Dude you are making a bigger smacked @$$ out of yourself, with each post. Quit, before you lose what little credibility & benefit of the doubt you have.

  38. JBird you are one of the most prejudice people on this site, with your stereotypes and shit…I recall you trying to play the race card with me a few months back, until I told you my wife was Italian……There’s a big difference between racism and prejudice and on this site, its not racism, its prejudices…Either not liking a QB because he does not fit the “stereotype” of what a QB should be…Or disliking the head coach, because he is over weight or his son had some run ins with the law…JBird, you really need to shut your mouth, because you really don’t understand!

  39. @DCar, unfortunately I don’t agree with you when you say Vick has won nothing, when in fact he has, those probowls, comeback player of the year award etc. mean nothing to you but those accomplishments weren’t just given to him, he actually earned and won them. For you to say he hasn’t lead this team is also wrong, he led them but if they don’t follow, (meaning when other players, drop ball, cause penalties, the defense doesn’t hold up), you really can’t blame him for that, he can only lead its up to the others to follow. I am not saying that Vick doesn’t need to step up mainly avoiding the ints…… he does, but to say he doesn’t lead is bull. If you feel he is NOT A GOOD QB, OVERRATED, STUBBORN, OVERHYPED, well it sounds like you have already come determined how the season is going to end.

    BTW, I’m not in love with anyone, a lot of you guys use the word LOVE too loosely on here. Just because we support and believe in our team including the Qb and you or others don’t like it, don’t give you the right to falsely accuse us of being LOVERS. But for some reason you “rock heads” can’t comprehend that or look without your rose colored glasses………….you see DCar that shit works both ways. One more thing I have noticed a lot of you folks resort to name calling when your opinion is not shared.

  40. No no…Peace…don’t explain yourself…DCAR seems to have a split personality…one hand he is defending the Eagles team, upset about the negativity (which I give respect to him for) then he comes out of his mouth, clowns the Head Coach and the starting QB of his EAGLES TEAM…

    Peace, I hear exactly what you’re saying when you say DCAR is talking out of both sides of his mouth…I think thats his alter ego, DVAN…

  41. LOL, my initial comment was about an entire team not just one player, however all you folks could take from it was Michael Vick……………..I wonder why.

    @greenfan, I never used the word “terrible” as you stated, not to mention I was not the only person to comment about the negative articles written about the Eagles, it doesn’t matter how it sounds to you, what matter is what I said.

  42. sounds like we disagree jmt …doubt that you can make a relevent comment, so I will leave it there

  43. LOL and anyone that thinks Tim Tebow, is more clutch than Vick needs to see a psychiatrist or get off the crack…The Tim Tebow comparison in the above article only emphasizes how much of a team game football really is…Jerry Brennan, your writing skills is, well…..ASS!

  44. @RealTalk, agreed

  45. vinnietheevictor

    and I haven’t even logged in yet….

  46. Ok peace, if you want to get stuck on the definition of terrible.

    Seems like a pretty straight forward statement, but you will need to clue us in on what you really meant by :

    “You’re right GCOBB is the most negative site as it relates to the Eagles.”

    So you want us to believe that this was a positive endorsment of the site?

    We all have the freedom to check out the site or not…and we all have the right to make whatever comment we want….my statement was that if this is “the most negative site as it relates to the Eagles”, why would a self-described Eagles fan want to be on here? Just asking peace, just asking.

  47. jbird, its comments like yours that fan the flames, why are you generalizing, making up stuff about how a group of fans looks at things, there is no need to go there, just state your opinion on the man’s ability to lead the team to a super bowl, we know that fraud McNabb couldn’t, its vick’s chance, and greenfan is correct, its about the quarterback,

  48. “Jerry Brennan, your writing skills is, well…..ASS!”

    Ha, you mean “are” right?

    “Me fail spelling? That’s UMpossibile” – Bart Simpson

  49. More on the Tim Tebow comparison to other QBs from the above article…looks like he was just as successful or more successful as some of the top QB’s in the league….so are we saying that he is more clutch than Brady and Rodgers, too? I mean everyone on the list in the article had a worst win percentage than Tebow…
    Had you left Tebow out of it, the article could have been taken bit more serious…

  50. Tim Teblow sucks. BTW Real, thanks for your free diagnoses again. I didn’t know loving something & criticising it, made that person have split personalities. This for your professional opinion. Where did you get your degree BSU, or University of you don’t know stugots.

  51. @greenfan, try understanding this, I don’t care what you think, I really don’t, you’re not important. But also understand just like you I will comment on this site and express my opinion whenever I want. Like I said before my initial comment was about an entire team, but all you could take from it was Michael Vick……………….enough said.

  52. Real…there you go getting all emotional again. People usually tend to get really pissed when you pull their card and hit the nail right on the head. So I guess I summed up your connection with Vick pretty succintly didn’t I?
    I don’t have issues with Vick. He is not an elite QB. But he is good enough to win a SB if he is put in the right position to do so. And that position probably includes not asking him to drive downfield in the final five minutes when we are losing a playoff game. How about we just play defense and just ask him to hand off the ball while we milk a ten point lead. I would have no problem with that. Like I said before I blame the Eagles failures on their inability to play defense and I blamed their slow start last year on their disorganized O line not on Vick. If he was not harrassed he would not have turned the ball over so many times.
    The guy can’t even turn around and the DT from Atlanta was in his jock as he took the snap. Thats not Vicks fault and it changed that whole game. He drives the team straight down the field against the Giants and Smith (who I swear was a double agent) has a perfect pass bounce right off his hands. Also not Vick’s fault. I love how I have equally defended and criticized Vick but you only see the criticizm. You see what you want to see Real. And you probably didn;t see the rest of this post because you probably wanted to fight me after the first paragraph. I am never going to shy away from stating the obvious. And it is obvious that black posters TEND to support Vick no matter what and do not want to hear any crtiticizm whatsoever.

  53. vinnietheevictor

    Vick is a polarizing agent.

    I don’t know what he speaks to….or what social ills he epitomizes. He’s just a bad QB that some people love to death.

    Clearly, there are 2 camps:

    Those who think he stinks (count me a member)

    Those who think he is the most incredible QB ever.

    There’s no in between on the guy. Frankly, I cannot for the life of me understand the rationale for group 2. Vick has done very very little over his career to warrant the blind adulteration. His reg season record is mediocre (at best) his stats are mediocre (at best) and is playoff success is below mediocre (at best)

    The idea of the “its a team game” statements are good to a point, but then fail. Just ask the Penguins. Or the Flyers. No goalie and they could roll anyone out onto the ice. If the same isn’t true in football, then how come Brady takes the worst D I’ve seen in 20 years to the SB? How come Balt can’t make it with Flacco at the helm?

    The reality is that this is a QB driven league, and the team will win or lose based on the QB. I think that puts the Birds in pretty dismal sape heading into the year.

    BTW Peace, please never put the “beating, GB in GB (almost by himself) is nothing,” garbage away…for good.. Dude threw for 82 yards in a game where the Pack turned the ball over 7x. Now there was one game where the QB played no factor atr all. It happens now and then.

  54. vinnietheevictor

    jeeez….adulation….where the f did adulteration come from?

  55. @vinnietheevictor, that is kind of how the Giants beat GB this year isn’t it, bottom line GB didn’t play well at all, fact is they didn’t even look like the same team that had been playing all season. Oh one more thing don’t ever tell me what to say.

  56. LOL Schiller – I get paid to work on Comp Software….not for grammar…If writing was my job, I’d care about spelling and grammatical mistakes…What are you GCobb English/Grammar professor…?

  57. @JBird – and like I said, it is obvious that you have some prejudices…just as your butt buddy that just joined the thread (Vinnie)
    So JBird – why do I defend Andy Reid? I’m not over weight, I have never been liked up for a crime in my life…is that because I’m black also…keep reaching, dumb ass!

  58. The “Professor”, is a good nickname for Schiller, Good one RT777,
    I believe this one will stick for a while… ha ha

  59. Real…I have also gone on record as stating that FOX and ESPN waved Brett Favre’s flag for YEARS and now try to do the same thing with “Matty Ice” because middle America needs a white hero. And I never approved of that crap. I am just calling out what I see. It is not an indictment of a race. It is just stating that I see an irrational reverrance towards an individual based on the need to identify. All humans have the need to identify with others regardless of race. I am merely making social observations but you get so mad you don’t even think about what I say. You just call me racist because I point to the fact that you would not pamper this guy if he was some cracker from Mississippi.

  60. OOOOOH, you said cracker. You will be reprimanded for that pal. BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

  61. Hey DCAR – I was just trying to help you out…one second your defending your team the next your flipping out…thought it may be possible you blacked out and DVAN took over..you know people with split personalities black out from time to time and may not have a memory of it…that’s all I’m saying, you should just be aware my friend

  62. realtak – no I was just busting you for busting another about grammar – by using poor grammar.

  63. OMG…peacegirl doesn’t care what I think…..I don’t think I will be able to sleep tonite…..NOOOOOOOOOO…..Not That!!!!

  64. Dcar doesn’t have split personalities, he’s just an emotional hypocrite. He’ll post whatever he feels like at any given time. One post he’s curing, calling name, and saying everyone is an ‘***clown” and then he berates people for name calling, freaking out and the like. He says he’s not arrogant, and then tells everyone that he knows better, is nver wrong, and shouldn’t be questioned.

  65. real, So that’s what happened to the last 3 hours. In all seriousness, I admitt, I do get carried away sometimes. But I won’t defend my honesty, open mind, my criticisms & passion, especially against imbecile stooges like Schill & Jon Hart.

  66. Dcar – I won’t question your honesty or passion. We’re on the same page ther buddy. No questions asked.

    And I don’t mean for us to be adversaries, just that you and I disagree on a lot of things.

  67. Schill, never said I was never wrong. I’m far from perfect. You just are proven wrong & made out to be a piece of garbage all of the time. Look in the mirror. You always accuse everyone, in being everything you are. You are the Queen of hypocrites & have ZERO knowledge, experience in ANY sport. AS I STATED MANY TIMES, you just come on here to get your jollies off & get under everyones skin, by being a criticising, corrective internet Nazi. Just go away & let the real men discuss things.

  68. Ha, and you say you’re not arrogant. Child please

  69. And so my point is proven… GCobb you got your hits today buddy. Scintillating debate evoking the gamut of emotional responses based on two names: Reid and Vick. I am pretty certain that GCobb knows that any article disparaging Reid/Vick will get at least 50+ comments and disparaging Vick alone will almost shut down the server… LOL!!!! I compare this approach to Eli Manning’s hailmary tactic… when shit ain’t workin’ throw the damn ball up and let your receiver make a play. LOL!!!! I can’t stand the Giants!

    Yes… GCobb is one of the most negative Eagles “fan” sites on the net… how do I know??? I’ve researched it. Why am I here??? It’s complicated. Roughly a year ago, the University of Michigan did a study on Fox news viewers which concluded that when presented with the truth about a subject that had been misrepresented by Fox news, a majority of Fox news viewers still believed the misrepresentation. Outside of being a die-hard Eagles fan I am intrigued by how negative people can be about Vick even when presented with the fact that many of his critics misrepresent or leave out many facts about his career. For instance one of the more prolific criticisms of Vick is that he holds the ball too long, but the truth is on average he doesn’t hold the ball any longer than other QBs in the league. So then the theory becomes he takes alot of sacks because he holds the ball too long when in reality Vick escapes more sacks than any other QB in the league. If he doesn’t hold the ball on average any longer than anyone else and he escapes more sacks than anyone else… is this really a problem? Well then Vick is indecisive, inaccurate, and can’t read defenses is the next criticism, but profootballfocus has his #1 receiver as having the highest drops percentage in the league. Also, many over look the fact that because the line played so poorly in the beginning of the season the Eagles often pull the TE’s and RB’s out of the passing game to stay in for protection. Then many will point to the fact that the Eagle’s O-line finished at the top of the league. Many fail to realize that while the left side of the line was evaluated very favorably, the right side was not. Profootballfocus is quoted as saying they are not certain if Herrimans is qualified to protect anyone’s blind side and their rating of Danny Watkins was not so good at all. Many overlook the fact that Vick had a QBR of over 100 in each of the last 4 games. Now the criticism will be that those were “meaningless games” but if that is the case then the overall rating for the O-line is meaningless as well because the bulk of their favorability came from the end of the season.

    Vick is not a perfect QB, but in the context of start to finish as a starter he’s undefeated in the division. In the context of start to finish as a starter he’s bested every other QB in the Division. Many say Vick is not clutch but he has 11 4th qtr combacks in his career… He’s never won anything and yet he’s done what no other has done before on many occasions in the biggest of moments. He has only been to 4 playoff games and only won 2 of them yet he did that under two different owners and two different HC’s (one named Jim Mora Jr) and with little to no offensive probowlers/all pro’s. Many will say he’s been in the league for 11 years… that’s not true he’s only been in for 9. Many will over look the fact that he’s played in 3.5 different offenses (the .5 is referring to 2010 season vs. 2011). I just find this stuff interesting.

    To sum it all up… I don’t care what posters/analysts/journalists say about Vick… I watch the games for myself and don’t allow the media to influence my opinion. But I do find it interesting that many try very hard to find and accentuate the negative about Vick and scoff at the positive as if it is so insignificant. But then again let me be careful. Don’t want to come across as a “stepford fan”. That shit was hilarious!!!!!!

    I’ll be back to play in a minute guys…. gotta attend to my mothers lawn.

    Go EAGLES!!!!!!!!!!!!

  70. eagles0superbowls

    Lions —-Vick holds onto the ball too long, not by waiting & looking for an open receiver but by not sliding, running out of bounds or trying to absorb DB bone crushing hits

  71. some cracker from mississippi is coming to quarterback the eagles?, now we’re talking

  72. vinnietheevictor

    1) He does hold the ball too long and takes unnecessary sacks because of it. 2nd worst in the league behind a guy none of us have ever heard of.

    2) You keep touting this “he escapes sacks” business as a good thing. He wouldn’t have to “escape” so many sacks if he didn’t have the ball in his hands after 3 seconds as he does much too often.

    3) Vick has 11 4th Q comebacks in 9 seasons (though none last year) Wow! Fantastic! Just like David Carr who also had 11 over his 9 years! And better than Chad Pennington, who only had 7 in his 5 years. And its more than Marc Sanchez who only has 9, though he’s only had 3 years. Colt Mccoy is on pace,to match Vick…he had one this year, which is more than VIck had….but it looks like he’s losing his job. Bobby Hoying had 3 in his year and a half with the eagles’…that’s twice Vick’s pace…perhaps we should have kept him around. Still, while 11 is good….it juuuuust doesn’t quite match the 29 of Drew Brees over his 10 seasons now does it. But hey, when we’re talkin’ Vick, mediocrity shines!!

    If a cracker from Mississippi was throwing up the same #s Vick does, then we’d have 100% of the posters on here shouting for him to be run out of town.

  73. @lionsden, great, great post, unfortunately they will never understand it.

  74. @lionsden, see I told you they wouldn’t understand it, check vinnietheevictor and eaglesosuperbowls as good examples.

  75. LOL Vinnie, you do realize comebacks come down to circumstance…is it possible that other QB’s have more comebacks because they were faced with the situation more often..Also how many QB’s have a fourth quarter comeback, the likes of the Giants game? Not many…I recall a few games last season where Vick was leading a drive and it resulted in a turnover by other offensive players…49ers games, Eagles got into field goal range had Maclin held onto the ball…Bills game, Eagles were driving when Avant committed a turnover…Tell me how many games in 2011, where Vick committed a turnover in the 4th qtr that sealed the victory? Granted there were times in where the Eagles offense could have put teams away in the 3rd or even 2nd qtr’s….and did not because a turnover committed by Vick…Lets say, there were about 5 or so games the Eagles gave up 4th qtr leads in 2011..If the defense had the talent that we’ll have in 2012, do you see the Eagles losing all 5 games? I don’t…Being the leader, Vick should shoulder the blame, no doubt…but blaming the man for lack of comebacks is foolish

  76. If Vick is the player I think he is…He will come out focused and on a mission in 2012…He said he wants to be a great QB, only way to do that, is to prove it on the field, which he knows…I am excited to see Vick after a full training camp (mind you, his first real training camp as starter, in what 4 years or so?) I can’t wait!

  77. @peace112… no worries I anticipated a response from Giants fan (aka Vinnie). The other post from Eagle0 is just funny I’ll let him read it again and see where he went wrong. Giants Fan proves my point every time he posts. Are you familiar with Pavlov and his experiments? OK watch this…

    @Giants Fan

    “He does hold the ball too long and takes unnecessary sacks because of it.” Please show me a state titled unnecessary sacks… better yet define an unnecessary sack please. Profootball outsiders disagree with you and so does Kapadia with regards to holding the ball too long.

    ” You keep touting this “he escapes sacks” business as a good thing. He wouldn’t have to “escape” so many sacks if he didn’t have the ball in his hands after 3 seconds as he does much too often.” Kapadia just showed you (per football outsiders) that Vick doesn’t hold the ball for that amount of time any more than anyone else and in fact some of the “elites” are worse then him: “In other words, Vick was basically in the middle of the pack on sacks resulting from holding on to the ball too long. Some quarterbacks who were worse: Cam Newton (3.5 percent), Tony Romo (3.2 percent) and Ben Roethlisberger (3.0 percent)”. Do you have a count of how many times Vick held the ball “too long”? What was the sample size you used to come to your conclusion?

    Kudos to David Carr, Colt McCoy, Chad Pennington, and Mark Sanchez for showing that they could bring a team back or contribute to the comeback for a victory. Having said that… Carr and Pennington are out of the league never to be seen again not because of voluntary retirement but because of mediocrity. McCoy is soon to be a distant memory and Sanchez well let’s just say if Tebow is brought in to challenge you for a starting position I won’t pile on… Vick my friend was in prison for 2years and a year and a half later was the QB of the future for the Eagles by beating out the “REAL QB” Kevin Kolb. How’d that prediction go by the way? Drew Brees is great, but I wonder why his teams have to be brought from behind so often. I mean 29 is alot of times when you don’t have your team in the lead until the very end.

    “If a cracker from Mississippi was throwing up the same #s Vick does, then we’d have 100% of the posters on here shouting for him to be run out of town.”

    I don’t like racial epithets but I assume you mean a white guy when you use the phrase “cracker”. Personally I don’t condone this and I don’t think you should either but that’s your call.

    Let’s play what if since your into that:

    What if Eli Manning’s Daddy didn’t tell the San Diego chargers they couldn’t draft his son?

    What if Eli had to face the same draft circumstances of all other NFL QB’s?

    What if Ben Rothlisberger wasn’t handed the Keys to a Ferrari when he was drafted to the Steelers?

    What if Tom Brady’s coach hadn’t stole and video taped opposing defenses hand signals?

    What if Matt Cassell were the QB of the Patriots?

    What if Drew Brees didn’t get a second chance in NO?

    What if Drew Brees didn’t have the one of the best set of Offensive Weapons in the league?

    What if Aaron Rodgers didn’t get to sit and learn for 3yrs?

    What if Aaron Rodgers wasn’t handed a loaded team?

    I have no what ifs about Peyton because he’s a baller, but it did take him 10 consecutive years in the league to win the big one and he has been forced out for a year because of neck issues which were very likely because of his style of play.

    Giant’s Fan… even those who don’t like Vick know your rants are hate filled and purely personal.

  78. stop with all this nonsense, as if vick hasn’t gotten a break or two from the nfl, are ou kidding me, this is his year, probably his final year in philly if he and reid don’t make a serious push in the playoffs, whoever said enough of these vick/reid articles, right on man, all this praise/trashing of vick is bs, he would be the first to tell all of you to stifle it, let his play determine his and the team’s status, enough, how about the phils?, 4 1/2 games out, suck on that you turd paulman, and sixers with a win tonight makes you look doubley foolish, john clayton wanna be nerd

  79. why don’t you two get a room?

  80. vinnietheevictor

    Oh, did you get back from mowing your mom’s lawn. I understand how important it is for you kids to earn your allowance. How else to buy the latest Vick poster to hang over the bunkbed.

    You clowns sound like Montreal Canadiens fan screaming “24 cups!!!” wnever someone brings up the fact that the team has stunk for 2 decades. Listen, it isn;t 1999 and this isn’t Virginia Tech anymore. Give it up.

    Lions….again…you read one thing and interpret another. Go read the FO article yourself. Stop relying others to interpret things for you. Vick is one of the worst in the league taking sacks over 3.5 seconds. Those are clearly “unnecessary”.

    ” Carr and Pennington are out of the league never to be seen again not because of voluntary retirement but because of mediocrity McCoy is soon to be a distant memory and Sanchez well let’s just say if Tebow is brought in to challenge you for a starting position I won’t pile on…” Ummm…exactly. Why did you think I chose them bucko? I’m glad Vick’s 11 4th Q comebacks (which you lauded earlier) compare favourably to those superstars. But hey, thanks for re-stating my point for me.

  81. For the Record, Aaron Rodgers was no handled a loaded team,
    The pack were old and on their way dfown in Farves last coupld of seasons and in fact, Rodgers was 6-10 in his 1st year as a Starter, but the Packers y had 2-3 excellent Drafts in a row netting them players like WR Jennings, TE Finley, WR Nelson & DT Raji, LB Matthews, and other quality players to go along with an excellent Coaching,player development Staff.. Rodgers did not walk into a Chanmpionship Team when he took over by any means…

  82. eagles0superbowls

    Can we please limit the # of characters in the comment area so we don’t have to read Leo Tolstoy’s opinion on Mike Vick all day

  83. @eagles0… If you were directing your comments towards me I’m flattered to be compared to one of the greatest novelists of all time. Much appreciation.

    @paulman.. part of Brett Favre’s rant about Rodgers was that he was surprised they (the packers) didn’t win sooner. With the exception of Raji and Matthews all of those players your mentioned were on the 2008 team. Offensively… that team was stacked.

    @Giants Fan… If you can’t understand that trying to compare players who have had consecutive years in the NFL and failed to a player who after being in prison for 2 years wins come back player of the year takes a rebuilding team to the playoffs one year later finishes second in the MVP race and wins the starting job from a recently drafted QB that really hadn’t had a chance to prove his metal is stupid…. then you are truly as advertised… not too bright.

    FYI Giants fan… leave my kids out of this.

    There’s one simple remedy to dealing with the length of my posts… don’t read them or acknowledge them. To paraphrase greenfan… “we have the freedom to post what we like… if you don’t like it why come to the site.”

    Go Eagles!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  84. OK another one of those little details that irk the shit out of me -

    The Ginats did not darft Eli Manning – the San Diego Chargers drafted Eli Manning – yes the Manning’s told the Chargers not too – but they did anyway – at #1 – the Giants actaully drafted Philip Rivers….

    the chargers got Rivers and the giants 3rd rounder that year and the giants 1st and 5th in 05… you decide who got the better of the deal – I think the Chargers took Castillo and Merriman in the 1st round in 05…..

    but I have seen a couple times now where the Ginats have gotten credit for drafting Manning….

  85. Excellent post lionsden; keep roarin buddy!

    Schill – “child please” is a no no on here my friend. This site is for avid rowdy eagle fans, not “hands on the hip” lingo. Get it together man, get it together. You don’t sound to kosher man.

  86. To Lionsden
    Remember back in on the 2008 Packers, lots of these players who are stars now, were 1st/2nd year players at the time that grew along with Rodgers to beome the very good Team that they are.. I am not sayign they didn’t have talent and a good roster, but you made it sound that Rodgers inhis first year replacing a 10-12 yera Legend QB in Farve was going to come in and the Tea mwin a Super Bowl right away, I don’t recall anyone having those high expectations of Th e PAckers Team or Aaron Rodgers in 2007/2008, and that like most young QB’s that he would improve and get better and better which he most cetainly has as theentire team around him has.. You making it sound like they were a Super Bowl Ready Team and becaise of Rodgers, that they slipped backwards in 2008 which I don’t believe is the case at all..
    If they were that good, why didn’t farve wine mulitple SUper Bowls his last few Seasons with them…

  87. There’s certain organizations that just know how to build from nothing and win Championships..like Giants, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Cowboys, Skins….49ers….

    These teams have wind multiple championships while we were competitive.

    I think we should study these teams and bring in a GM with the blue print….We had Modrak who began to build that type of environment and could have been a good marriage with him and Reid..If Reid didn’t power trip and screw the scouting team up.

    Now, we’re wallowing in mediocrity…

    There’s a formula for Championship teams but we will never get a “Chip” until we get a GM and Coach that realize you can’t reinvent the wheel.

    By the way…..”The Wide 9″ is not a Championship caliber defense…The 3-4 covers those gaps better with creating gaping holes behind the line of scrimmage.

  88. With the O-Line a HUGE question mark going into the season all I can say is to re-double what I’ve already said and that’s to put DJax on the left side where Vick is most comfortable throwing instead of leaving him on the right. Speed in the right place and in the fight order of QB check down reads can do wonders for Vick’s speed in delivering passes.

  89. @paulman… I see your point. I am in no way trying to disparage Aaron Rodgers. He is an excellent QB and I have much respect for him and love the way he plays the game. My intent was to highlight how some QB’s come into better situations than others. Ryan grant, Donald Driver, Cullin Jenkins, Atari Bigby, All Harris, Charles Woodson, Jordy Nelson, Nick Collins, Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila, Donald Lee were all on that 2008 team and were all solid contributors. Rogers was great that year throwing for over 4000yrds. I don’t take anything away from him but he was introduced to the league with a great team at his disposal. He came into his own in 2010 and they won the SB, but he had loads of help. That’s all I’m saying.

    @Rocko… what’s up buddy?!

  90. @Navy… with regards to Who got the better of the deal between NY and SD what’s your opinion? Do you think Rivers would have 2 or more rings now if he went to NY? I mean… did Eli make the team or did the team make Eli? I hate the giants so you guess my answer…

  91. vinnietheevictor

    In 2008 Rodgers had Ryan grant, Donald Driver, Jordy Nelson, Donald Lee …

    Well, Desean, Maclin, Celek, Lesean are better than that 2008 gb crew..

    ….and yet I can guarantee you that the 10 yr vet Vick will not put up the 64% 4000yrds 28td 13 in, #s a first year starter Rodgers did with his inferior playmakers, and completey aurtocious oline…..

    Again….always excuses….Vick isn’t good because he’s never had “playmakers”…ever consider they weren’t playmakers because Vick was the QB?

    Desean’s #s have dropped the 2 yrs Vick’s been the starter, Celek’s #s have dropped…Maclin dropped this year…Lesean’s recieving numbers dropped this year…….

    Oh…and from the “read one thing interpret another” that seems to be your MO Lions, I saind “you kids” (meaning you), not “your kids” (which suprises me, because I didn’t think people could have kids before puberty)

  92. yeah lions – I hear ya. Merriman and Castillo started out great but after Merriman popped for roids – he went down hill..

    as for would Rivers have won two SBs had it been Rivers in place of Manning -

    I am absolutley unimpressed with Peyton Manning… I think there are two many people that listen to the jack nuts on ESPN that sit around talking about ‘the QB’ – if being a great QB was what it took to win SBs – Peyton would have about 10 of them – Farve won his when he was surrounded by a great team – Elway won his when he had a great team (Terrel Davis) Big ben has 2 SBs – and the one over seattle was IN SPITE of him, not becuase of him… it is most definitely a TEAM game…

    do I think the Ginats are happy – sure… remember the other shoe on that trade – becuase of Rivers – the Chargers let Drew Brees walk in FA…

  93. vinnietheevictor

    Lets review the timeline:

    1 – you say/imply Vick is “clutch” because he has 11 4thQ comebacks. You use this stat to promote how great Vick is.
    2 – Because 11 4th Q comebacks is shit for an nfl “superstar” I point out that 11 comebacks puts Vick in the same league as Carr, Pennington and other pieces of crap.
    3 – You misinterpret my point and say (paraphrasing) that those guys are all crap and out of football…Vick is better…….
    4 – I thank you for making my point for me…VIck should be out of here (or rotting on the Raiders) just like they are….
    5 – You then fall back to to the failsafe Vick apologist position (myth) 1, “How dare you compare Vick to those guys – he was in prison and returned a superstar! Comparing Vick to them makes you an idiot!!!” Despite the fact that, actually, all I was doing was finding comparables to the stat you lauded earlier as something that makes Vick “clutch”. As clutch as a bunch of shitters. That’s the kind of clutch we need!
    6 – Still backpedaling, you fall back to position (myth) 2, that Vick has never ever ever ever had any playmakers…that eveyone else around Vick sucked and he won because of them…funny, seem to remember Brady setting records this year with a small white guy and 2 TEs…but hey, those are just details……
    7 – Then there’s failsafe position (myth) 3…Vick had 2 coaches, and 3 different offences!! That was the reason!! No tother QB has ever, ever, ever had to go through such turmoil……

    What will fallback myth 4 be?

  94. Rocko, that’s because Schill is a sissy drama-Queen. I’ve trying to tell you all that. If any of you can’t tell that he is a sissy, tootsie boy, by all of the content of his posts, just pay attention a little closer & you’ll see. Between his pom-pom waving, thin skin against criticism, always correcting everyone, & blaming fans for being too critical on the players, thus affected their play because their feelings are hurt, should convince everyone what Schill is all about.
    “Child please!” BWAHAHAHAHA!!! My 12 year old Niece, Aisha says that. You are a foolish, pathetic excuse of a man. You should be ashamed of yourself. BTW, how does me proving you wrong all of the time, & proving to everyone, what a pathetic, know-nothing, sissy, dopey imbecile, that you are, make me arrogant? Just because I have more knowledge about life, & sports than you do, & live in reality, doesn’t make me arrogant. Sometimes, you sound like a jealous, scorned, delusional, school girl. If the truth hurts Queeney, I highly suggest you not come on here. I’m not telling you, just suggesting, with the freedom of speech & all. But since you never agree with anyone with common sense, sense of reality & what we say hurts the multimillionaires, & your feelings, either suck it up, or stay away. You can disagree with anybody you want, but try backing you disagreements up with some facts, common sense, reality, knowledge, & some research & not just through labels on everyone, you disagree with. We are all fans, & want our teams to win, titles & Championships. We aren’t haters & fake fans, as you like to through out there. Life is too short to think you no it all. Get out of your parents basement, experience life, & go find a woman, not the kind that you masturbate to in Japanese Anime porn. I honestly feel sorry for you sometimes, but your stupidity is just nauseating now. Go on Eagles.com & Iggles.com & annoy them.

  95. Can’t wait for the spin, turn around blame, & hypocrisy, to be spewed out of the human sphincter. (x)

  96. STOP Already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Run the darn ball, play tough “D”, let Vick run and throw a bit and we will win a Super Bowl just like we would have when McNabb was here… OF COURSE IT’S ANDY!!!!!!!!

  97. Someone please find a post of mine that qualifies as “pom pom waving”. I challenge you to do so. And Dcar – I was wrong about what? Not saying I never was, but you said “By the way how does me proving you wrong all of the time”…

    – WHEN? Got examples?

    Dude, you can claim to be “manlier” all you want. But to deny that feelings and emotions go into sports, shit, Dawkins would slap you upside the head for saying somnething like that. Plain and simple. I’m sure of it. FOOL

  98. And for the record – I NEVER said that anyone (except for that enigma Paul) is ‘less of a fan’ or anything like that. I personally think all the negadelphian/haters/IDpeople etc….fans ARE fans. They’re just as much fans as the most pom-pom waving, nonstop merch and ticket buying, go to every trainingcamp, calls into eagleslive everytime fan. PERIOD. The idea that there is 1 type of fan that is “More REAL” or “More TRUE” or “More DIEHARD” is a foolish myth. There are many ways to be a fan and there’s many different shades of fanhood.

    I NEVER suggested otherwise.

    I DID suggest that fans who mostly hate, and shower players (or contribute to it) with hate and nothing but barragement of negitivity contribute negitvely to the perfmorance of the teams – I stand by that.

    But they’re still 100% fans. Just a twisted messed-up type of fans.

  99. those so called twisted fans probably get to the type of athlete you would be schiller if you ever wore a sweaty jock, but not to the type of athlete we want and give high praise and boos to where appropriate, the hunter pence type who recently said he is even more excited to get to the park, get it going becuase of the boos directed his way, players that need the fan’s affirmation are mentally weak, and they are not for this city

  100. Jake – Interesting points. Pence is certainly a guy that seems to be able to take the Philly hate. Let’s see if that lasts throughout his career.

    ********************************************************

    NOW – YOU MADE A VERY INTERESTING POINT: “players that need the fan’s affirmation are mentally weak, and they are not for this city”

    About that – SO I’d put some players in that category – Donovan McNabb. Andrew Iguodala, Brzygalov, Jimmy Rollins and you could name a few more but lets start there. THOSE GUYS WERE IN PHILLY in KEY roles. And some of them were potentially capable of doing even greater things for the teams if they DID have fan’s affirmation – but they didn’t. You can say “THEY ARE NOT FOR THIS CITY” – but that’s THE VERY CRUX OF MY POINT. You don’t just want a championship. You (and fans like you) IMPOSE AN EVEN HIGHER DEMAND – YOU WANT A CHAMPIONSHIP WITH WHAT YOU DEEM TO BE “PLAYERS FOR THIS CITY”. YOU MAKE IT HARDER FOR SOME PLAYERS TO PERFORM WELL HERE BUT YOU DON’T CARE ABOUT THAT.

    THAT”S MY POINT – if you put your lazy selfish “I want players that can adapt to my treating them poorly” aside, maybe we’d have more championships. But you don’t just want a championship – you want it your way. It’s EXTRA greed. EXTRA demands.

    That’s f-d up in my mind. I didn’t love every single player as a person on the Phillies championship – but I sure as hell loved that they won it.

    Do you GET THAT?

  101. Why is Jimmy Rollins still a Phillie anyways…

  102. Paul “Paulman” TheEnigma – “Proving the old saying that “There’s no such thing as a stupid question” wrong since 1701″

  103. Good one Schiller, but Rollins Batting Average, On-Base % and Slugging % Is among the Leauge lowest for all Lead-Off Batters and has 6 RBI’s so far. .
    Batting Average .232
    On-Base % .282
    Slugging % .291

    These are bad #’s for a #8 Hitter let alone an expereicned Lead-off Batter
    Take Juan Pierre’s # as a comparison who has 6 RBI’s
    Batting Avg .340
    On-Base .387
    Slugging % .379

    Or Even Freddie Galvis who has 16 RBI’s
    Batting Avg .235
    On-base % .273
    Slugging % .374

  104. schiller, you are annoying as hell, I could go dcar on you, but at times you are entertaining for a nerd, with the exception of rollins, all those other athletes are the type that do not win championships, they do not have the mettle, and rollins does have the mettle, if he couldn’t hack the fans he would have bolted in free agency, I know he has made comments about the fans but he was pandering to his interviewer, stop with all this psycotherapy for players, damn, they are millionaires, pampered, we pay their salaries, hail rev songs

  105. Paul – he is sure having a bad season so far. But that doesn’t make your question any more valid.

  106. jake, I can’t agree with you more that they are millionaires, pampered, we pay their salaries. But that does not in any way change the fact that they’re human beings. Human beings are effected by psychology. Every single freakin one of them that has ever been and ever will. That’s a fact. You can cry ‘toughness’ all you want, doesn’t change the facts. Psychology is tied to brains – if you have a brain, you’re subject to psychology. Just like every athelete with an ankel is subject to achilles injuries, every athlete with a functioning brain – even Burfict – is subject to psychological and social stimuli. Just facts man.

  107. Yea, I’m not too sure what is going on with Rollins. He better get out of this funk soon.

    Chooch has been our MVP so far this season.

  108. Sorry annoy you Jake. I’m not changing. You have the power to not be annoyed by me. Excersie that if you wish.

  109. Heard Coughlin is getting a new deal in New york….now that’s a winning coach…I guess it will take another 14 years for the quaker oats guy (Andy Reid) to get back to the NFC championship game.

  110. If coveting thy neighbor is truly a sin, than Songs has a shit ton of atoning to do….

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