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Was Andy Reid Shining Light On Nate Allen Or Howie Roseman?

For years Eagles head coach Andy Reid has gone out of way to protect his players.  He’s still doing that but not nearly as much.  It could because he’s on his way out or there could be another reason.  It could be a way to shine light on the poor job done by talent evaluator and Birds GM Howie Roseman.

if you wonder why the Eagles have a problem at the safety position, it’s very simple.  They drafted Allen in the second round in 2010 and Temple safety Jaiquawn Jarrett in second round in 2011.  Allen is now on the bench and Jarrett isn’t on an NFL roster.

Yesterday he shed some light on the obvious problem with the play of Allen, who is a safety who was drafted in the second round in 2010.  Reid was asked why special teams ace Colt Anderson and seventh round pick Kurt Coleman would be starting ahead of Allen in the upcoming battle with the Redskins.

“Colt came in and we asked him to fill in at the line of scrimmage and be a physical player in there and he did a nice job with that”, Reid responded. “We needed that at that time and we’re going to need it this week. They run the football and do a good job with that. So, we’ll leave him in that position and let him continue to do that.”

As for Coleman getting the starting nod and Allen being  benched:

“All three will probably have an opportunity to play”, Reid responded. “But again, right now, Kurt is a little bit more stout in there and we need that. We need that this week.”

First of all, Allen is bigger and faster than both Anderson and Coleman, but he doesn’t play nearly as aggressive.  To me Allen seems hesitant when attacking ball carriers.  The safety catches the runner rather than attacking him.  He’s also a step late when going after the football in the passing game.  Allen doesn’t turn it loose the way he should and play confidently.  Reid shared what Allen needs to do going forward.

“The first thing was to stay healthy”, Reid said. “He’s been up and down with that. Then, just continue to get better. That’s the primary thing; just keep taking steps forward to get better.”

Take a look at the 2010 draft with defensive end Brandon Graham, who is finally starting to play like a number one pick after two and half years of doing nothing.  The second pick was Allen.

The next pick was defensive lineman Daniel Te’o Nesheim, who was obviously a project, who did nothing here and is currently starting for Tampa Bay.  Next up was cornerback Trevard Lindley, who they have brought back here a couple of times, but he isn’t on a NFL roster.

The 2011 draft class is even worse with offensive guard Danny Watkins, who is sitting the bench right now.   How do you draft a 26 year old guard in the first round?  People get guards from all over, but they don’t use first round picks on them.  I’ve heard from a couple of sources that he wants to be fireman much more than a NFL player.  Both Reid and Roseman told he was going to be great.

No other teams have touched Jarrett and he’s out of the league. Here you have a second-round pick, who nobody else in the league will go anywhere near.  I heard both Reid and Roseman sing his praises when he was drafted.

Cornerback Curtis Marsh was drafted in the third round, but can’t get off the bench, despite the poor play of the Eagles starting cornerbacks, Nmandi Asomugha and Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie.

Linebacker Casey Matthews was drafted in the fourth round and was a starter at the beginning of his rookie year before losing the job and being relegated to the bench since then.  He plays on the special teams.

I think the 2012 draft was much better with Fletcher Cox, Mychal Kendricks, Vinny Curry, Nick Foles,  Brandon Boykin and Bryce Brown.

There are some people who want to give credit for the 2010 and 2011 drafts to Reid and give credit for the 2012 draft to Roseman, but you can’t do that.  Reid had final say in all of those drafts but Roseman was the guy who went out and evaluated all of these players.  Roseman didn’t have final say in the 2012 draft, so you can’t get credit for that one without also giving him some of the responsibility for the 2010 and 2011 drafts.

I clearly remember him taking credit for both the 2010 and 2011 drafts.  I can’t really say that I know how much Reid was responsible for and how much Roseman was responsible for, but we do know that each of them played the same roles in all three of those drafts.  Who should get the credit for both of them?

Regardless of who the Eagles new coach is, Jeffrey Lurie must make sure Roseman is the guy he wants evaluating and drafting the players. on Facebook

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Posted by on Dec 20 2012. Filed under BREAKING NEWS, Eagles, News, Secondary. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

34 Comments for “Was Andy Reid Shining Light On Nate Allen Or Howie Roseman?”

  1. When Andy gets fired so should glorified accountant Howie Roseman.Howie is a guy who should be doing your taxes not picking your future players on a NFL team,if Howie Roseman stays on as GM THIS TEAM WILL NEVER WIN A SUPER BOWL

    • At the end of the day, the guy behind all this circus nonsense is Jeff Lurie.

      I’m afraid we might have to come to grips with the fact that we will never win a super bowl with Lurie hiring incompetent hacks to run the franchise.

  2. Its all andy.. no excuses, he had the final say on all these picks. Roseman wasnt the gm all 14 years.We havent drafted a all pro linebacker reids entire tenure.He hasnt drafted a great defensive player his entire career.He never could evaluate defensive talent.
    I dont know what roseman is made of yet. I dont know if reid vetoed any of his decisions, but we’ll find out this draft.
    I have to admit the 2012 draft looks promising, maybe roseman had more of an imprint on that one

    • That’s my understanding as well. That Reid has final approval authority. That’s why he holds the dual title of Head Coach/Executive Vice-President of Football Operations and is listed on the front office staff ABOVE Roseman which, to me, suggests hierarchy. Roseman doesn’t actually go out in the “field” personally to evaluate players. The Eagles, like every other NFL team has a scouting department. See below:

      Louis Riddick Director of Pro Personnel
      Anthony Patch Director of College Scouting
      Ed Marynowitz Assistant Director of Pro Scouting
      Jake Hallum Senior Scout
      Tom Donahoe Senior Football Advisor
      Andy Speyer Southwest Regional Scout
      Brett Veach College Scout, Southeast
      Roger Pollard National Scout, Combine
      Michael Bradway College Scout, Northeast
      Brad Obee College Scouting Coordinator
      Alan Wolking College Scout, Midwest
      John Middlekauff College Scout, West Coast
      Dan Hatman Pro Scout
      Greg Gabriel Scouting Consultant

      THESE are the people that actually visit the prospective players environment and do the evaluations and submit the reports to Roseman AND Reid (Who has final approval authority, remember).

  3. I’ll be honest, I don’t really care where a player is selected (1st,3rd or 7th Rounds) Nate Allen is in his 3rd Season as an Eagle and has made Zero Progress,in fact, he’s regressed as most of these young players have the las tcouple of seasons, so I have to look at the Coaching and the Schemes and fOrmations that the Coaching Staff puts these Players in and the last time I looked, Andy Reid is the Head Football Coach of this Team and Repsonsible for his Staff to improver the Players on the Roster..
    I don’t hear/read HC’s in New England, Green Bay, Atlanta,Baltimore blaming their GM’s for questionalbe Drafts.. You Coach the Players you have and you devise systems,schemes and formations that that best utilize their Skills to help the Team and to be honest, Coach AR has never been good at this and especially with Players on the Defensive Side of the Ball
    I am tired of hearing excuses from the Franchise from it’s Front Office to it’s Coaching Staff down to the Players… Coach and Develop the Players up that you have..

  4. Nnamdi Asomugha suggested that he’d be open to restructuring his contract in order to stay with the Eagles in 2013.
    Asomugha knows he won’t be back at his $15 million salary next season. He’s graded out among the worst starting corners in the league this season, meaning the paycut he takes is going to have to be drastic. The Eagles also have to decide if they’ll attempt to re-sign impending free agent Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie. GM Howie Roseman will have a lot on his plate this spring.

  5. I think they will end up keeping Asmo on a Restructured Deal and DRC will bolt in Free-Agency for more $$$ that’s offered him by the Panthers or Titans..
    I believe That DRC and his Agent will get more $$$ Offers than the Eagles are willing to SPend unless Asmo comes way down ..

  6. It doesn’t matter “how good” Roseman might be, the fact of the matter he is NOT a football guy. Unless he has superior scouts and recognized evaluators of talent, he’ll sink. Lurie needs to get the BEST talent evaluators even if Roseman does nothing more than coordinate the scouting.
    Agree with Pman that the assistant coaches need to be excellent teachers at their position assignments… that is up to the new coach but Lurie again needs to evaluate the next coach’s ability to hire top OC/DC and assistants. The SB winning franchises have top scouts, FO & coaching…not hard to figure why some teams keep winning SB’s or remain contenders. It all starts with owner and flows downward. Nobody gets a free pass in the chain.

  7. We have seen for years, lots of examples off very Talented Prospects fail to live up to their Potential.. some of it is on the Player, but a lot of it is on the Coaching or lack of Coaching..
    Get a Vic Fanngio, or Brad Seely, or Ed Donatell, Mike ZImmer, Russ Grimm as the Next HC who will stress Fundamental, PHysical and Hard-Nosed Football and stay away from the Genius, Gimmicky and Gadgest Style of Football for this is what we’ve just had for the last 14 Years under
    Coach AR and Company.. Back to Basics and Blue COllar Football that Philly used to be known for ..

  8. Howie may want credit for the draft selections in 2012 but I know he doesn’t want credit for these 2 GM trades which the birds lost (Asante Samuel and Winston Justice) and these 2012 Free Agent signings ( Demetrius Bell, Derek Landri or DJax at franchise tag money)or these 2012 contract extensions (Trent Cole and Todd Herremans)

  9. dieR ydnA always has to do everything butt backwards.

    Jeffy Loser gave the FAT MAN unlimited power and the Emperor exceeded it.

    All’s you have to do is look at the Juan Castillio coaching move. That tells it all in a nutshell. Drafting the 26 year old fireman was just icing on the cake, in buffaloe butt’s 14 years of “Frank Sinatra”(I’ll do it my way) coaching.

    I am so glad to see a bright light being shined on this Pied Piper of coaches. A big Fat Fake.

    Unfortunately I have been told that David Shaw signed an extention to stay at Stanford.

    I would wish for the Alabama coach, but why leave the top Program in the country. He gets to coach NFL talent and have the top recruits in the world dreaming to play for him. Saban could smack the School president in the face and security would arrest the school president for getting his face in the way of Saban’s hand.

    There is no way Jeffery Loser is going to hire Chip “gimmick of the month” Kelly.

    I hope RGIII has a career day against the Eagles. I want the stench of the Andy Reid era to be so strong that they burn down the NovaCare complex just to be sure all his DNA is gone.

  10. My goodness and this was the best era in Eagles football. Buddy Ryan couldnt hold AR jock in wins, looses, playoff wins and losses but he is loved. Trust me I love Buddy to. Success is measured diferently in this town I guess. I understand AR has gone way past his prime but come on man he had the most success in Eagles history.

  11. Now that you average AR Career Wins over a 14 Year Period, they are not as great as you think.. It’s like a QB who plays 10-12 Years with one Team, an of course in Todays Pass Happy NFL, that QB will eventually accumulate godo stats..
    Career Regualr Season Record (129-88-1) averages to 9.2 Wins per Season
    Versus 6.3 Losses per Season
    Career Postsean Record (10-9)

    Good Numbers, but not Great and clearly nowhere near HOF Level
    Again the Eagles Franchise has had many more “Down” Seasons then “Up” the Fact he has the Best Record for the Eagles is all relative to
    the many other Great Coaches who actually won Championships
    The biggest thing I find disturbing, is that he’s become worse the longer he Coaches, and when he;s actually had more Talent on his Rosters and he’s just not innovative/flexible enough and does not adjust well enough as the game unfolds which seperates the “Good” Coaches from the “Great” Coaches.. Overall he’s had a good Run, but like anything else in Sports, it;s what have you done for me lately and lately being the last 4-5 Seasons are simply Average which is what he’s become, an Average Coach who can’t beat the Good Teams or the Big Games and lately cannot beat even the Bad teams with newbie Coaches

    • Well said Paul……..

    • Good post. The Reid butt-sniffers ALWAYS seem to conveniently overlook the fact that he is “The winningest coach in Eagles history” because he is the LONGEST TENURED COACH IN EAGLES HISTORY. Through longevity alone, the odds favor those numbers. Jeez!! Had Ryan or Campbell, or Kotite, or Rhodes been given the same length of time, who’s to say that the Eagles wouldn’t have won a Super Bowl or two during that period. REID IS OVER RATED.

      • Slick, maybe Ryan if he would have gotten a clue about offensive game planning but Kotite proved how bad he was when he went to the Jets, Campbell stunk so bad he could have had 20 years and never won more more than 8 games. Rhodes had his shot and he was only defensive coordinator material anyway and only mediocre at that.

  12. Finally…Andy will be the hell outta here…I’m counting the days

  13. There is no one in the eagles organization who should be proud of the recent drafts.

    I heard a lot of talk today about Reid maybe staying on as the VP of Football Opps. I sure hope not…

  14. Paulman, those padded wins came at a time when the nfc east stunk, notice when the giants got better, cowboys at least relevant, and now the redskins, Reid can’t win, you will never convince me he was a good coach, without that defense, Jim Johnson, he would be a zero

    • there is absolutely no such thing as ‘padded wins’ in the nfl- that is such bs.
      as for JJ– you don’t think all coaches rely on their highly paid coordinators? ridiculous.

  15. I really don’t Care what Coacr AR did in 2002, 2004 or 2008 for it’s irrelevant today in 2012 in my opinion
    Since the 2009 Season, The Eagles and Coach AR and the Eagles are
    33-29 (with 2 games reamining this Season) with an 0-2 Playoff Record
    Enough Said don’t you think.. This Franchise has not only become average
    but hasn’t beaten an opponent with a Winning Record (outside of NFC East Games) in a while .. Yes the Beat the RAvens early on, beat the Texans in 2010 and a banged up Colts in 2010, but they have been owned by the better Teams in the NFC for the last few seasons (Packers,Bears,Falcons) come to mind.. Time to move on..

  16. agreed he should be fired based on performance thelast 3 years

  17. Paulman’s Eagle Mock Draft for 2013 (Version #4)

    1st Rd (4th Overall) – OT Luke Joeckel (Texas A&M 6-6 305lbs)
    (Starting RT from Day 1 and replaces Peters at LT by 2014/2015)

    2nd Rd (36th Overall) – CB Xavier Rhodes (Fla State 6-1 217lbs)
    (Competes for open Starting CB, has long arms,speed and actually likes to hit)

    3rd Rd (68th Overall) – DT Sylverster Williams (UNC – 6-3 320lbs)
    (In the 4 man Rotation as the designated Run Stuffer/Short Yardage and Red Zone Packages)

    4th Rd (100th Overall) – LB Nico Johnson (Alabama 6-2 245lbs)
    (Compete for SAM Starter Spot and has frame to put on 10-12lbs easily and maybe eventually replace Ryans at MLB in 2014/2015)

    5th Rd (132nd Overall) – Safety Shawn Williams (Georgia 6-1 218lbs)
    Another Physcial Player with SPeed in the Secondary to compete for Time and a SPecials Teams Demon, see as an eventual Strong Safety)

    6th Rd (164th Overall) – TE Travis Kelce (Cincnnati 6-5 260lbs)
    Another tough-nosed funfamentally sound player from Cincinnati, Jason’s younger Brother with SIze, Good Feet & Blocking and Excellent Hands

    7th Rd (196th Overall) – Guard Jeff Baca (UCLA – 6-3 300lbs)
    Provide Depth at the Guard Spots, Tough, Physical Player coached by former NFL HC Jim Mora Jr at UCLA in a Pro-Style Offense and Terminology

    I do believe the Eagles need to pursue a Veteran Safety in Free Agency who are still under 30 and in their Primes right now (Jarius Byrd, Dashon Gholston,William Moore, Louis Delmas)

    I also think they should pursue one of the Following Talented CB’s who all some some baggage but should be hungry and motivated to prove themselves again in the NFL (Mike Jenkins of the Cowboys, Aqib Talib of the Patriots or Marcus Trufant of the Seahawks) who all have Pro-Bowl Talent

    And maybe Pursue 1 Big WR Target like a Bowe (who wants to go back to Southern FLoria and play for the Dolphins) Greg Jennings (Packers)
    or even a Mohamed Massaquoi (Browns at 6-2 210lbs) who both have had some minor injury issues this Season …

  18. Paulman, what about targeting a big, strong wideout early in the draft, is there any wideout worthy of a top selection, because that is the eagles biggest need on offense

  19. He’s Jake, there are some big WR’s who will be on the board in
    The 2nd/3rd Rounds, I will give a list in a little bit
    I would only go this route if Eagles can Trade a player or 2 to get some additional early round picks though

  20. How will I remember Reid?

    The best head coach of an organization the never won a Superbowl.

    He’s only great by Philly measures.

    I never want to hear him compared to Bill Cowher or Marv Levy again because they at least had multiple Superbowl appearances and Cowher actually won one before retiring.

    He will be remembered on the same par as Norv Turner and Lovie Smith if you’re viewing this from a broad perspective.

    ok…but no where near great.

    And now I can say definitively McNabb have been vindicated.

    The Reid apologists who put everything on Mcnabb stated when he was drafted that the team would be better off without him.

    It’s not

    I don’t care how you justify letting him go claiming he was over the hill….best years behind him garbage..(heard that concerning Dawk too)

    You don’t shake the veteran core of your team and sell the public unproven players.

    Now, the apologist see what we have seen all along…that McNabb carried Reid and not the other way around.

    Ray Rhodes players carried Reid and not the other way around.

    JJ’s defense carried Reid and not the other way around.

    When they were no longer around Reid’s boneheaded decisions were now magnified opposed to being masked.

    Based on the analysis he always made stupid decision compared to the juan to defensive coordinator even back then but the good coaches and players overcame them.

    And if you don’t believe that just look at the firing of Modrak and Marc Ross and his scouting team who were all replaced with guys Reid chose from Heckert on down.

    Single- handedly destroying the strong talent evaluating mechanism that was in place before he got here.

    He wrecked the whole team from the front office down and now we’re left with Howie Roseman the accountant to try and fix it.

    Does this give you guys hope or optimism concerning the Eagles going forward?

    I’m done.

  21. It gives me hope, but I am very concerned about Roseman’s
    Lack of Football acumen and not sold on Tom Donahoe as
    The next VP of Football Ops since he failed and made questionable player personnel and draft choices while with the Buffalo Bills
    So tome it comes down to who the next HC will be
    Is a Coach who demands respect and has a successful track record in schemes, evaluating talent, can adjust in game time conditions or will it be a “newbie” HC who has to learn to grown into the position and all the things involved with it.. It will be a huge hire and decide the next 5-7 Year Future of the Eagle Franchise no doubt..

  22. hey songs , your boy burflict is looking pretty good , he woulda looked good next to ryans and kendricks . any body know how the safety we signed and cut is doing antoguye ( whatever his name was )

    • GMCliff stated all summer that Vontaze Burfict should be moved to OLB, from MLB, and look where he starts for the Bengals…..OLB

      and yes the Eagles should have signed him as an undrafted free agent.

  23. Otegwe was not picked by any Team Fyi
    He’s too beat up and slow

  24. To GMCliff
    If Ray Ray Armstrong missed his Senior Season due to Transfer Issues
    I wonder if he won’t be invited to Senior Bowl Week and the Indy Combine
    Due to his Status which will hurt his Deaft stock big time, don’t you think
    Since Pro Scouts/Coaches won’t be able to eye him up in person and see what the kids has to offer.. He could be a steal in the 6/7 Rounds

  25. Let’s get this right…..The Eagles didn’t want a steal undrafted player with first round talent in Burfict but kept garbage ass Matthews who they believed was a steal in the 4th round last year?

    This team have some serious talent evaluation issues and all the scouting team should be fired. Every last one

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