Eagles training camp is less than two weeks away. They’ll start on Monday, July 22nd at the Nova Care Complex and everybody’s eyes will be on the quarterbacks. There are numerous questions to be answered during Chip Kelly’s first season as head coach of the Birds, but none more important than the questions surrounding the quarterbacks.
Of course everybody’s wondering who is going to be the starter, but that’s not the only question.
Will Kelly’s system work on the NFL level or will he have to abandon much of it? The uptempo style has already been proven to be effective by the New England Patriots, along with the tight end focused passing game.
To me the big question concerns the health of NFL quarterbacks, who are asked to run with the football on a regular basis. Last year Redskins rookie quarterback Robert Griffin III went down late in the season after running the read option all year. San Francisco’s Colin Kaepernick, Seattle’s Russell Wilson and Carolina’s Cam Newton were all able to stay away from injuries despite running with the football. Kaepernick and Wilson made it a point to get on the ground when they were approached by tacklers, and Newton is built like a rock and weighs 250 pounds.
Kelly still believes he can have his quarterbacks running with the football and keep them healthy. We will all find out whether that is true or not. There are still plenty of coaches in the league, who don’t believe you can have your quarterbacks running with the football and keep them healthy.
I could tell by the amount of time the Eagles invested in working on the read option during OTA’s and mini camp, that Kelly wants to run that system. He knows a running threat at the quarterback position will make his running game better and give the defense more weapons to think about.
I don’t see how he’s going to be able to do that with an injury-prone quarterback like Michael Vick. The veteran quarterback hasn’t been able to stay healthy on a consistent basis throughout his career.
Nick Foles and Matt Barkley aren’t capable of being legitimate run threats in the read option offense, so I don’t think it’s feasible to use them in this running attack. I do think both Foles and Barkley are capable of running the hurry up offense by calling the plays at the line of scrimmage.
I think odds are that Kelly will be forced to abandon the read option before a third of the season is completed. The plan of the running the read option could go up in smoke before the season even starts, if Vick goes down to injury in the preseason. Vick could also start turning the ball over and that could cause him to be benched or released.
I would be shocked if Vick wins the starting job and keeps it throughout the season. It could happen, but I don’t think it’s likely. . I do think the Eagles will run the football effectively, which will take pressure off the quarterback and the defense. Still the odds are against Vick winning the starting job and being able to keep it throughout the season.
Chances are that Foles or Barkley will be starting by mid-season. If and when this happens, the read option will be put on the shelf.
eagles news out their on the internet
CSN Philly believes “it looks like a stretch,” for tight end Clay Harbor to return for his fourth season with the Eagles.
Harbor is buried on the depth chart behind Brent Celek, James Casey and rookie Zach Ertz, making him likely to be cut if the Eagles can’t trade him. The tight end has been mentioned as a possible target of the Patriots to replace Aaron Hernandez, but we believe they can fetch a more talented player than Harbor via trade.
Source: CSN Philly
Jul 9 – 9:22 AM
Riley Cooper – WR – Eagles
CSN Philly’s Geoff Mosher believes Riley Cooper may be on the roster bubble headed into training camp.
Mosher considers DeSean Jackson, Jeremy Maclin, Jason Avant and Damaris Johnson “locks” to make the team, but believes the other five receivers on the roster are competing for “one or two,” spots. Arrelious Benn has experience outside, in the slot and as a return man. His versatility is said to be coveted by coach Chip Kelly, and could make Cooper expendable.
Source: CSN Philly
Jul 9 – 9:13 AM
I believe the Eagles will move a TE since it’s a real deep Position on the Team,
I can see a Deal with the Pats (TE Celek for one of their CB’s McCourtey)
Pats have depth a CB and the Eagles need to solidify at this Position
A Win-Win for everyone, McCourtey is coming up on Contract Year and Celek Starting Days in Philly will be gone by 2014 as his snaps get replaced by Ertz & Casey..
Make the Call Howie and get it Done
If Celek is traded to New England, I will have him on my Fantasy teams, because he will be used like he is supposed to be, and not held back to block.
But , I don’t think he will. I seriously doubt it, because I also don’t think Zach Ertz will be as much of a factor as some envision him to be. So they will need Celek.
Kelly cant keep Vick healthy or any QB on the roster. Buhhhhhhhhhhh bye Mike Vick whether its preseason or he gets shelved mid season buuuuuuuuuuuuuuh bye
As far ar WR Position, I definitely see 1 or 2 Receviers (Avant or Cooper) being Traded & not making the Eagles 53 Man Roster. I think Avant makes the 2013 Team for his hard work,leadership and his mentoring of Younger Players… Cooper is a long shot at best.. He’s never really developed when given the opportunity.. He does have some size but still hasn’t learned to use it effectively.. Benn could be a real find and I think will take the Role and Snaps from Avant & Cooper where Benn can play the “Slot”, the Outside” and in the “Red-Zone” and Special Teams which again can open up another Roster Spot for another Position
Avant will be on the Eagles roster this year….Stone cold lock. Bank on it.
teams arent trading for these guys. this aint mlb, teams wait for cuts then pick up the scraps. you should know this
Most of the time, that’s correct MHenski..
But if a Team is very thin at a Position (like the Pats are at TE) or a Team sustains an Injury to a Starter with no capable Back-Up, then the Teams
would want a Player in during Camp/Preseason to at least learn their System and be ready for the Season… Of course this would probably be only the Top Teams who are built for Now.. What happens if Pats lose a WR or another TE in Camp, or if the Texans have an injury to Andre JOhnson or RB A Foster or the Bengals QB Dalton goes down… or 49ers Kapernick goes down… Who knows..
The entire NFL will abandon the Read/Option offense before long. It will go away just like the “Run and Shoot” went away in the 90’s, and the KC Chiefs “Wing T” went away in the 80’s.
The NFL will always require a sophisticated passing attack to win. Chip Kelly’s “Zone Read” formation and the set of plays that he used at Oregon will not work in the NFL.
The Eagles will be a WCO that runs a sub-set of plays from the “Zone Read” formation. Just like the 49ers…. When Vick goes down the other QB’s will run the same offense.
The read option and the current NFL salary structure that pays QBs more than any other position are at odds with one another.
The read option exposes a QB to about 10 more hits per game than normal (on runs and blocking). That’s twice the punishment a guy like Brees takes (at lest). More injuries.
No owner is going to fork out $20 mil a year for a guy that’s going to miss 1/3 of the games in the trainers room.
The only way it works is if a team has 2 or 3 $3 million interchangeable guys (which the Eagles seem to actually have right now) that can be subbed in whenever one goes down (often)
Soon enough big name free agent QBs (and potentially high round draftee QBS) may begin avoiding read-option teams because they will lower their future earning potential.
It helps to have a mobile running threat when running a read option it makes the play have three possibilities. However it is not 100% necessary to have a “running qb” in order for it to work. Last year Bryce Brown had some of his best runs on read option style handoffs with Foles in the backfield. the idea is to get the defense to commit to a direction or get them flowing then to either keep the ball hand it off or pass. The blocking scheme of the o-line is actually more important than who is at qb. Foles or Barkely can run it at times as a straight run play or as a play action pass. That will keep the defense on their toes as well. When they see Foles stick the ball deliberately in a RB’s stomach in that formation the defense will collapse assuming run. It can be a very effective play action to set up deep passes or even wr and other back side screen plays. It can also be used as a base play call where the QB gets to the line and decides the defense is telling him to do something else. The communication could be with just the QB o-line and WR. Do that enough and you will have gaps and lanes to run through. its simple if Vick plays you will see more of it if Foles or Barkley plays you will still see it prob not as much but will still be used and still be effective if ran and set up properly. Not every Oregon QB had blazing speed and they used it regardless and it worked. Football is about execution and the team moving as a cohesive machine no matter what you run. Nobody will run an offense entirely consistent of one principle so the read option will never take over or disappear into obscurity. principles of the Run and Shoot are still used in todays game same will be for read option and any other style that works in any fashion.
Eagles will run very little of the “Read-Option” Offense,
Maybe 6-8 Snaps of the 70 Snaps a Game.. They will run a more
“Stanford Style” of Offense.. Double & Triple TE Sets, Power Running and Play action off the fake hand-offs with Screens to WR, RB & TE out of multiple sets..
I’m very interested in Chip getting Vick through a whole season without injury as his starter. If Vick is playing at the end of the season that means the team is in the hunt, which may land Chip coach of the year honors.
Chip Kelly exudes ego and would love to show the NFL he’s smarter than other coaches and he might just shock the world with Vick at the helm. Chip and Vick both have something to prove.
Go Eagles!
It’s not up to the Coach to prevent Vick from getting injured.. Vick has to play smarter and do a better job of protecting himself and the ball.. Only Vick can do this.. not his Coaches or Teammates.. Play Smart MV7 is what it’s going to take and stop trying to be a hero on every snap.. Can Vick learn this at this stage of his Career ?? .. If he doesn’t, he won’t be playing for the Eagles..
Tom Heckert (Director Of Player Personnel for the Broncos) faces DUI Charges and CAreless Driving in Douglass Country, Colorado from a June 11th incident
This follows this past Weekend Arrest and Charges of Bronco’s Director Of Scouting, Matt Russell, for Driving under the Influence. Team Owner Pat Bowlen and President John Elway are livid, embarrased and may actually Fire both of these 2 Guys for this..
Both Hecket and Russell worked together for the Eagles when Heckert was GM under Andy Reid and Russell was working for the Scouting Dept..
Well G I could care less what system Kelly runs. They could step out there running the the wishbone for all I care. As long as it yields a SB. So whether Vick or somebody of 20th and York. Don’t care as long as they can play and it yields wins. My theory has always been that the NFLis manned by very smart guys; but large egos. The history of the league bears this out. It’s the reason why some very smart men for generations wouldn’t allow some to play certain positions. Not because the denied could not, but simply because those that made the determination had built in biases. You got guys like Flutie who was better than 3/4 of the starting qbs in the NFL during his day. But because he didn’t have the measurable he never got a legit shot. Thank goodness Pete Carroll didn’t but into that dumb shit. Oh and how proficient did Wilson look running that offense. It isn’t just about a qb running around aimlessly, but when and where. What other facets of the offense are being used; personnel, et..etc..
To simply say something (R/O or Mobile QB) can’t work and then cite history is both stupid and disingenuous. One has to factor in when or how often the supposed inferior system/players were used/implemented against the norm or status quo.
Sound’s Good Brewski,
Problem with Eagles & Vick is that Vick has shown over his 11-12 Year Carrer not to be “Smart” enough to make the good decisions consistently to effectively run any Offense and has always reverted back to “School-Yard” ball running around with no rhyme or reason trying to make a Play..
“He (Vick) is what we thought he was” which is a Great Athlete playing the QB position, but not a True QB..
No QB can survive 12 years in the NFL without being a true QB nor can they be a starter their entire career.
Not gonna do the Vick thing…..I will Comment on Flutie though, Only been 3 college QB’s I got excited to Watch and Flutie was one of em. Can’t agree with you more on Flutie Cold…Wilson is a better QB then given credit for. The run option has always been around in part, and always will be. This year defenses will clamp down on it and the next innovation will come soon. Either way a pro QB’s first responsibility is to protect and deliver the football. Although I agree with the sentiment Cold….I doubt the Wishbone would yield much in the pro’s.
I disagree. I don’t believe Vick’s whole career can be summed up as you stated. But I’m use to such statements. Been around a long time and know through personal experience where much of it comes from concerning guys like Vick. It’s the reason why so many were/are pissed at Kelly for NOT feeling as you do. He’s on record with stating otherwise. It’s the reason that the NFL has a much LONGER history of retreading qbs who can’t play and coaches who stink. Most of it has little to do with talent or accomplishment. The league is much better now however. Now if only the ignorant fanbase can catch up, we’d all be much better for it.
Maybe I can sum it up even easier “Underachiever” ..
Remember, we are talking about the #1 Overall Pick in the 1998 NFL Draft
Evidently Chip Kelly disagrees.
If Chip Kelly knew he was going to be able to Draft QB Barkley, which was a complete gift.. then Vick would never have been re-signed to begin with..but back in January, Kelly needed to feel more secure with just QB Foles/Edwards under Contract, he goes out and signs the familiar Dennis Dixon which has no risk, no big $$ or committment.. He screwed up right out of the gate in my opinion…
I believe it will be Foles in 2013 with Foles & Barkely battling it out in 2014..
What is ignorant about stating that a QB, drafted 12 years ago and with only 2 playoff wins over that time, is pretty much the definintion of inneffective?
And paul is completely corretct, the moment adversity hits, Vick immediately reverts to running around willy-nilly. The guy has spent an entire career trying to spin outside a rushing DE rather than step up. Occasionally it works (Giants) but mostly is doesn’t.
Observing something that happens over and over and over and over and commenting on it is the exact opposite of ignorance.
You know what, these articles are nothing but speculation and we fall for this crap every time.
Just because Vick has been injured doesn’t mean that he can’t make it through a season.
We don’t know what’s gonna happen. As Chris Berman used to say “that’s why they play the games”and that is so true.
I truly belive that Vick is going to prove you people wrong AGAIN…. then everyone will say that they saw this coming lol.
Bunch of clowns.
We’ll see what happens one way or the other
My entire point for this Off-Season has been Why bother “Wait and See”??..
Just like D McNabb ran his course as QB, and HC Andy Reid ran his course as Coach of the Eagles.. So has Vick’s time with the Eagles and now with a rebuilding process with an entirely new Coaching Staff, Systems in place to build for Future Success.. Why have VIck even compete for a Roster Spot which is taking away Reps and Game Experience away from Foles,Barkley, who will actually be on the Roster in 2014 & Beyond.. A stop-Gap PLayer or Two for a Team that’s ready to Win now is one thing.. but to have a “leftover from a losing Culture” on the downside of his Career just makes little sense to me moving forward and has a bigger chance of derailing Chip Kelly’s rebuilding program than actually helping it and I believe that Kelly is aware of this ..Mike Vick will be released on August 1st to allow him the chance to hook up with another Team and to save the Eagles Vick’s $3.5 Million Roster Bonus that is due Aug 2nd per his Contract..
very well said
You guys make it seem like we have zero talent. We have talent. If we can play some defense and have our o-line perform, we have a chance. You’re probably one of the females that will call for us to rebuild, then complain about the losses when they start piling up. F rebuilding. I want to win now and Vick gives us the best chance. Also, I think Vick should have been MVP in 2010 over Brady due to the circumstances that Vick overcame that year (no reps in practice, not being on the team period, and having a fan base that wanted Jeff Garcia to stay..wow I just did that) You people are supposed to be knowledgeable fans, but I can’t tell.
Questionable health and depth at the Center Position (Kelce coming off a ACL Injury/Surgery
The Right Side of the OL still has Big Question ?? and is Unproven
Herremans played LG next to All-Pro J Peters but has never played RG in the NFL.. A RT in Lane Johnson who is a Rookie and will experience growing pains like any other ROokie.. and especially if he has no Contract and misses any time at all at Training Camp
A completely new Defense and new Schemes
Who plays DE opposite Fletcher Cox in the 3-4 (Thornton,Geathers??)
Starting CB’s are Willaims & Fletcher
Starting Safeties at N Allen and probably P Chung.. (Kenny Phillips will not be 100% and possibly never return to the level of play)
All 4 Secondary Players playing with new Teammates for the 1st Time with new Schemes on top of it.. There is going to be an adjustment period of apprx 2 months to get used to each other’s tendancies,strengths & weaknesses.. Offense will need to put up 27-28pts at minimum to have a chance of any wins for Eagles Defense will give up Points, Big Plays as they learn to gel with each other..
Special Teams still rank in the bottom of the NFL, now with some new players and Coaches, maybe they can be improved for they surely can’t be much worse…
Lot’s of issues and concerns for this 2013 Team let alone who the QB will be… Can they win 9-10-11 Games and make the Playoffs in a stacked NFC Conference..I guess it’s possible, but the reality is that the Eagles will Win 5-7 Games in 2013 regardless of who the QB is which is why when your rebuilding, choose the PLayers who will be around for the Future and have promise and upside, not older,aging players on the downside of their career’s ..
I would say bye to Vick, & T Cole immediately, and look to Trade Brett Celek and either WR D-Jax or J Maclin for both will not be with the Eagles in 2014 so move one of them now while their Value can return something.. Maclin is not going to re-sign with Philly, he has never liked the area that much and would prefer to play closer to him
(St Louis, Kansas City,Minnesota, Tennessee could all be good landing spots for him next year in Free-Agency) so if I am the Eagles and could get a 3rd or 4tt Round Draft pick in Return, then he’s gone out the door.. Give me players who want to play here..
So you are calling other people dumb, but you think that lack fan support should make be considered when they choose the MVP? Or lack of reps?
it would be one thing if you argued that he put up the stats that he did even though he missed 4 games, but wanting to count fans booing and not practicing is pure lunacy.
Very well stated Paul.
It’s funny to see people like coldbrewski, and Dag, and even Biglion throw out those veiled accusations about the fans who want Vick gone. You would think Vick was the best player in the league and we want him gone because we have an agenda….
The truth of the matter is – 90% of the people who want Vick gone feel that way because he is not a good quarterback….. And 90% of the people who want Vick to be the starter feel that way because he is black.
I also been around a long time and know through personal experience where much that comes from…. Vick sucks and everybody knows it, but certain people want him to be treated special…
Irish I have pointed out more then a few times that you have color on the brain must be guilty about something. Dude if I accuse you of something it won’t be veiled. I told you if you don’t like Vick that’s your right for whatever reason. Just don’t assume black people like him because he’s black it makes you sound ignorant and racist. Is that direct enough for you?
In order to prove us wrong “again” he has to first prove us wrong “once”
@Irish
Must be nice to be the sole arbiter of who’s playing the race card. I happen to disagree. The many comments on this very board bears it out. See whether you in your arrogance want to believe it or not; too many have revealed their hand in this argument. You’re so delusional you can’t even see how bigoted your assertion is. No matter how many times a poster like big or even myself state that we’re not Vick fans in regards to our favorite qbs; guys like you to bolster your bias will continue to paint us as vickpologist or some other dumb-ass insult. What makes you and people like you any less racist? How do you know that myself or any other who continues to counter endless insults and hatred aren’t just doing just that without a racial angle? I hve numerous of posters on this very site who have introduced your very claim just because they feel ENTITLED. The epitome of racism.
“bares” it out
Oh the white coach disagrees with you. But hey some of those who think like you have already concluded that he’s in collusion with the owner to promote a black legacy of qbs. But that probably wasn’t racist to state that without any proof. Me pointing it out is what’s racist.
Did I mention the white new coach disagrees? Irish miss me with your bullshit selective outrage.
Well truth is there are people out there who want Vick cause he is Black and there are people who don’t want him because he is black. Let’s not be stupid here. I can say I don’t like his QBing Skills never have…Gone on record many times about that. Fact is though all it takes is one person pointing fingers making allusions either way to bring out the stupidity. People on this site as soon as you don’t agree with their assessment yell Racism or you obviously don’t know football…other things include Dumbass and not a real fan. Apparently if you don’t agree with people you fall into one of those categories. Ive tried to make conversations that are not bias or insulting to others…The truth does make people enemies it seems here. Funny how we all say the Eagles are the most imprtant thing but it doesn’t really seem that way to me. Like it’s a personal victory if a certain QB is a starter…no matter how many games the Eagles lose….It infuriates me to no end….I digress though this isn’t personal, I just know Ill be there first Monday night no matter who the starter is. In fairness I think Vick is a bad QB and won;t lead us anywhere…that being said Ill still be there…so let’s voice our opinions but with some respect and brotherhood as Eagles fans…Stop putting the hostility in here…let’s get this straight Vick isn’t gonna pay any of you money for supporting him or having his back…and Foles/Barkley don’t know any of us exist. Get real and get green.
Love it X, that is being a real truthful honest Eagle fan.
Amen.
Talking about “Entitlement” and you are talking about Mike VIck as far as Football goes.. I like how Vick has changed his life and his personal story of redemption, but his self-denial, self-centered, arrogance, excuse after excuse making way of how he goes about demanding how he should be the Starter QB and a being a “True Leader” of a Football Team just makes me sick to watch for my hometown Team for he has never demonstrated any virtues of True Leadership, Accountability, Repsonsibilitly and Team First Attitude his entire Career..so someone tell me how he is going to start now at the age 33.. because Chip Kelly is the HC or because he finally realizes that this is his last chance and the click is ticking ?? You are either a Leader and make those around you better or you are not.. VIck has not demonstrated to me over his Career that he is a True Leader and Winner at the NFL Level and I have watched and followed Football very closely for some 40 Year’s .. It’s nothing Personal with me for I don’t get close to Players one way or another .. It’s about Performance, about Leadership and being a Team Player and Vick has very little in his game that I like at all or about his style of Play.. though I do admit that he throws some of the Best Spirals in the NFL even though many of them are off Target, thrown too late, or to the wrong side of reciever, etc,etc…
You’re full of shit paulman. You’ll just keep moving the goalpost on this Vick shit. None of his teammates have stated he was a bad leader and lacked the necessary qualities and intangibles to lead at that position. None of his coaches have questioned him there as well. The last I checked, what some clown-ass wannabe internet gm thinks about him personally(AND IT’ S BEYOND PERSONAL WITH GUYS LIKE YOU) don’t mean jack. Lurie and the coaches have the inside track there. And it’s also where the buck stops. Paulman doesn’t know Vick other than what he’s read in the media along with his already entrenched biases.
Lastly, aren’t you on record stating how tired you are of discussing Vick?
Then why are you always in the middle of every discussion about him? You sound like a hypocrite to me.
Must be nice to be the sole arbiter of who’s playing the race card.
This from the guy who wrote “But I’m use to such statements. Been around a long time and know through personal experience where much of it comes from concerning guys like Vick”.
Piss-off coldbrewski… rally around the poor persecuted victim if you want to… just don’t call me a racist cause I say he sucks as a quarterback.
Fine I won’t call you a racist. As long as you don’t state that the 90% who want him as qb do only because he’s black. See it works both ways asshole. You don’t know me and you never heard me or anyone who supports him on this site say he should be because of his color. Assholes like you arbitrarily through that assertion out
Fine then. You, nor anyone else wants him on the team because he’s black.
But you can’t possibly want him because of his quarterbacking skills.
So why then?
The perma-scowl?
Perhaps his fashionable taste in cars?
Music?
It isn’t about his race, you’ve stated that clearly….and it can’t be because of his quarterbacking, which is bottom tier in the NFL….so please, enlighten us….why such passion for a scrub?
I’ll make this easy Vinnie. Mostly I defend him from the ridiculous comments that seem only to apply to him and more importantly what I like is the same things the coaches in the NFL see in him that has kept him there for 12 years. People who get paid to make these decisions disagree with you and everyone other poster who talk the same nonsense on every Vick article.
He can run fast, and throw the ball a loooong way….Ok….what else? Nothing else above average and a lot below average. Who cares about a million dollar arm when you have a 5 dollar head. Bottom line, He has been over rated his entire career because of those two attributes. Promise doesn’t always translate.
People who get paid to make NFL decisions also keep giving Carson Palmer, and Jason Campbell, and Matt Flynn, and a zillion other scrubs contracts.
You seem to think that the “people who get paid to make these decisions” actually know more than other people.
They do not.
They just get paid to…If I was accurate at my job like they were at theirs I would be homeless without shoes. It’s Not just football, Cleveland Just Signed the Flamingo Kid AKA Andrew Bynum for 2 years……Sigh.
Thank you Captain Obvious, do me a favor next time you go to your Doctor get a second opinion from your auto mechanic he might know better. Tell me how that works for you.
That was for Vinnie X, not you.
@paulman
You’re making shit up as usual. I or any other reasonable fan don’t need your “interpretation” of Kelly’s motives involving Vick or any other qb signed prior to the draft. HIS STATEMENTS about the current personnel were clear. And your rational concerning him drafting Barkley is more of the same bs.
Stop with your hometown bs paulie, you have no allegiance to our city, you left over thirty years ago, you have no fandom, you are an ill equipped muckraker, short on intelligence, big on arrogance, dope
And I still call them as I see them Jake, no matter where I live..
I can spot a Loser & Cancer on a Team when I see them
And Vick & D-Jax are just that… Let’s see if the “Man-Up” under HC Kelly,
My $$ is that they both will revert to their usual, immature & selfish ways
By week 6-8 of the Season..
Another topic that has been beaten to death. Since Kelly was hired there has been about 100 articles about the Eagles QBs and health. About 50 articles on GCobb alone. QB health will depend on the QB of course. It will be Vick, Vick will have to make the proper decisions, when to get out of bounds, when to get down, he needs to avoid the big hits. I do believe Kelly’s offense tempo will benefit Vick, with a more even mix of the running game.
***NFL News
Patriots CB Alex Dennard arrested for DUI in his Hometown of Omaha,Ne which is his 33rd-4th Offense since his Sophpomore Season at Nebraska
IF any of you recall, Dennard was the Big 10 CB of the Season and was origanally projected as a 2nd Round PIck in the 2011 Draft.. The Pats got him in the 7th Round and then he sustained a ankle injury his Rookie Season.. I would bet to guess that with this “Hernanzdez” case going on up in New England that CB Dennard will be released by the time I finish this Post… Kids has Talent but can’t stay away from touble it seems..
**Correction on Name — Alfonzo Dennard
Many NFL defensive coordinators and coaches agree with my feelings – the read/option will soon be gone….
> Pittsburgh’s Mike Tomlin predicted a short shelf life — calling it “the flavor of the month.”
> “I don’t think it stays,” said Cincinnati coach Marvin Lewis, defensive coordinator of the 2000 Baltimore Ravens. “A young quarterback can do it, OK? But that young quarterback will never get a second contract because he’s going to be beaten up. And you can’t be a passer and take hits on your shoulder like these guys are going to do getting tackled.” “It’s option football,” said Lewis. “We all coached in college, and we’re used to playing option football and the assignments that come with it.”
> Mike Zimmer – “But it’s like Michael Vick when he first started in Atlanta and Donovan [McNabb] when he was first in Philly. It’s a different style of quarterback. Then what happens when you get to that second contract is that it becomes a different deal. You’re not running like you were….
> “It’s obviously not being taken very lightly,” said Indianapolis coach Chuck Pagano, and I don’t think anybody should. It’s the trend right now. But if you go back to the wildcat when it was first sprung by Miami on New England … they weren’t ready for it. Nobody was. It had its success, then peaked a little bit, then fell off. I don’t know how long this will last but we’re going to be ready — just as everyone else will be — to defend it.”
> “Just my opinion,” Cincinnati defensive coordinator Mike Zimmer said, “but if you’re a disciplined football team you’re going to play it OK.” “As far as ‘the flavor of the month,'” Zimmer said, “I believe that, but we have to stop it before it becomes ‘the flavor of the month.’
The read-option and the economics of the NFL are diametrically opposed.
I expect economics to win out.
Marcus Vick @MVFive 20h
Zimmerman better get 30+ years in prison. If my brother had to do 2 years it’s a must. Not self defense when u chase down an innocent kid
Marcus Vick @MVFive 21h
A dogs life means more than a humans? Or a black person life huh?
Collapse
Marcus Vick @MVFive 21h
He could’ve fired warning shots!!! I hope the homies in the BIG house go bananas on his racist ass.
I like this response:
Glen Macnow @RealGlenMacnow 20h
“@MVFive: A dogs life means more than a humans? Or a black person life huh?” Bad idea to be going there, Marcus.
lmfao does marcus know that zimmerman is not white?
in my opinion marcus vicks thoughts and tweets is a classic and textbook example of why racism still exists today
Here’s a transplanted Canadian’s view on that disaster happening down in Florida:
A dagger at the heart of Justice
by Marc Steyn
Just when I thought the George Zimmerman “trial” couldn’t sink any lower, the prosecutorial limbo dancers of the State of Florida magnificently lowered their own bar in the final moments of their cable-news celebrity. In real justice systems, the state decides what crime has been committed and charges somebody with it. In the Zimmerman trial, the state’s “theory of the case” is that it has no theory of the case: might be murder, might be manslaughter, might be aggravated assault, might be a zillion other things, but it’s something. If you’re a juror, feel free to convict George Zimmerman of whatever floats your boat.
Nailing a guy on something, anything, is a time-honored American tradition: If you can’t get Al Capone on the Valentine’s Day massacre, get him on his taxes. Americans seem to have a sneaky admiration for this sort of thing, notwithstanding that, as we now know, the government is happy to get lots of other people on their taxes, too. Ever since the president of the United States (a man so cautious and deferential to legal niceties that he can’t tell you whether the Egyptian army removing the elected head of state counts as a military coup until his advisers have finished looking into the matter) breezily declared that if he had a son he’d look like Trayvon, ever since the U.S. Department of so-called Justice dispatched something called its “Community Relations Services” to Florida to help organize anti-Zimmerman rallies at taxpayer expense, ever since the politically savvy governor appointed a “special prosecutor” and the deplorably unsavvy Sanford Police Chief was eased out, the full panoply of state power has been deployed to nail Zimmerman on anything.
How difficult can that be in a country in which an Hispanic Obama voter can be instantly transformed into the poster boy for white racism? Who ya gonna believe — Al Sharpton or your lying eyes? As closing arguments began on Thursday, the prosecutors asked the judge to drop the aggravated-assault charge and instruct the jury on felony murder committed in the course of child abuse. Felony murder is a murder that occurs during a felony, and, according to the prosecution’s theory du jour, the felony George Zimmerman was engaged in that night was “child abuse,” on the grounds that Trayvon Martin, when he began beating up Zimmerman, was 17 years old. This will come as news to most casual observers of the case, who’ve only seen young Trayvon in that beatific photo of him as a twelve-year-old.
In that one pitiful closing moment, the case achieved its sublime reductio ad absurdum: After a year’s labors, after spending a million bucks, after calling a legion of risible witnesses, even after the lead prosecutor dragged in a department-store mannequin and personally straddled it on the floor of the court, the state is back to where it all began — the ancient snapshot of a smiling middle-schooler that so beguiled American news editors, Trayvon Martin apparently being the only teenager in America to have gone entirely unphotographed in the second decade of the 21st century. And, if Trayvon is a child, his malefactor is by logical extension a child abuser.
Needless to say, even in a nutso jurisdiction like Florida, the crime of “child abuse” was never intended to cover a wizened old granny kicking the ankle of the punk who’s mugging her a week before his 18th birthday. But, if Aggravated Pedophilia is what it takes to fry that puffy white cracker’s butt, so be it. If, for the purposes of American show trials, an Hispanic who voted for a black president can be instantly transformed into a white racist, there’s no reason why he can’t be a child abuser, too. The defense was notified of this novel development, on which the prosecution (judging by the volume of precedents assembled) had been working for weeks or more likely months, at 7:30 that morning. If you know your Magna Carta, you’ll be aware that “no official shall place a man on trial . . . without producing credible witnesses to the truth of it.” But the rights enjoyed by free men in the England of King John in 1215 are harder to come by in the State of Florida eight centuries later. So the prosecutors decided, the day before the case went to the jury, that Zimmerman was engaged in an act of child abuse that had somehow got a bit out of hand: No “credible witnesses” to this charge had been presented in the preceding weeks, but hey, what the hell? Opposing counsel taking the reasonable position that they’d shown up to defend Mr. Zimmerman of murder and had had no idea until that morning that he was also on trial for child abuse, check bouncing, jaywalking, an expired fishing license, or whatever other accusation took the fancy of the State of Florida, asked for time to research the relevant case law. Judge Debra Nelson gave them until 1 p.m. At that point, it was 10:30 a.m. By the time the genius jurist had returned to the bench, she had reconsidered, and decided that “child abuse” would be a reach too far, even for her disgraceful court.
The defining characteristic of English law is its distribution of power between prosecutor, judge, and jury. This delicate balance has been utterly corrupted in the United States to the point where today at the federal level there is a conviction rate of over 90 percent — which would impress Mubarak and the House of Saud, if not quite, yet, Kim Jong Un. American prosecutors have an unhealthy and disreputable addiction to what I called, at the conclusion of the trial of my old boss Conrad Black six years ago, “countless counts.” In Conrad’s case, he was charged originally with 17 crimes, three of which were dropped by the opening of the trial and another halfway through, leaving 13 for the jury, nine of which they found the defendant not guilty of, bringing it down to four, one of which the Supreme Court ruled unconstitutional and the remaining three of which they vacated, only to have two of them reinstated by the lower appeals court. In other words, the prosecution lost 88 percent of the case, but the 12 percent they won was enough to destroy Conrad Black’s life.
Multiple charges tend, through sheer weight of numbers, to favor a result in which the jury convict on some and acquit on others and then tell themselves that they’ve reached a “moderate” “compromise” as befits the reasonable persons they assuredly are. It is, of course, not reasonable. Indeed, the notion of a “compromise” between conviction and acquittal is a dagger at the heart of justice. It’s the repugnant “plea bargain” in reverse, but this time to bargain with the jury: Okay, we threw the book at him and it went nowhere, so why don’t we all agree to settle? In Sanford, the state’s second closing “argument” to the strange, shrunken semi-jury of strikingly unrepresentative peers — facts, shmacts, who really knows? vote with your hearts — brilliantly dispenses with the need for a “case” at all.
We have been warned that in the event of an acquittal there could be riots. My own feeling is that the Allegedly Reverend Al Sharpton, now somewhat emaciated and underbouffed from his Tawana Brawley heyday, is not the Tahrir Square–scale race-baiting huckster he once was. But if Floridians are of a mind to let off a little steam, they might usefully burn down the Sanford courthouse and salt the earth. The justice system revealed by this squalid trial is worth rioting over.
So its okay to kill a kid for going to the store for skittles and ice tea? Vinnie that’s a lovely manifesto but the bottom line is a kid died for absolutely no reason. Guilty or innocent this kid died senselessly.
The NFL coaches who Vick has played for would never have him as their starting quarterback. He wont be playing for the Jets, Chiefs, Texans, 49ers, and several other teams with coaches who know him.
Most NFL people have seen all they care to see of Vick. It’s only the fact that Kelly thinks (like past fools) that he can fix Vick that he kept him around. How many guys take a huge pay-cuts to keep their job? Just guys who can’t get another job…..
If you watched the Eagles the last two years, and you still want Vick as the starter, then your attraction to him must be based on something other than his performance on the field. He lost the starters job last year.
I’m glad you know that for a fact Irish, dude you don’t like Vick we understand. You think he sucks as a QB that’s fine your entitled to your opinion but obviously NFL people who get PAID to make those decisions see it differently and I guarantee it has nothing to do with color.
back to the earlier point about the doctor and the mechanic. If the mechanic had been exposed to medicinal practices for 40 years. Had coached it, played it, watched it, argued it, lived it…..then yes, his opinion probably would be valuable.
Vinnie, I can’t match your 40 years but I can come in around 30 but my point is this. I don’t worry about things I can’t change we go round and round and I admit its entertaining but at the end if the day I have no say in who the teams I root for employ. I just root for Philly teams and hope for the best.
Oh course it is not ok to kill a kid. Of course it is not ok that he died. And I agree completely that he dies senselessly. (And we could perhaps get into an argument to why so many of you feel the need to be carrying handguns at all times)
But, on a larger societal scale, and when we look at the complete erosion of freedoms and liberties in the western world (not just the US – but you guys are on a fast track) it is arguably worse that the state can go around attempting to convict someone of some charge, any charge, even though they have no evidence, just because it “feels” like the right thing to do.
One day they might arbitrarily feel a different way.
Now that is something I agree with you 100%.
Fellas, let me tell you what frustrates me the most about this whole thing down in Florida. It’s a distraction, people are focused on it for the wrong reasons. In Chicago this weekend from Friday to Monday 12 Blacks were murdered…and 50 were shot….yet the media and country is focused on a wanna be cop and a kid with stolen Jewelry in his back pack. Not that it isnt a tradgedy or failure on some level…But we have GENOCIDE in 2013 American cities. Detroit, Chicago, St louis…week after week and the media is quiet. I have no faith in the media to tell the truth anymore or for the leaders of the black and white communities to be honest with each other or the world. Not everything is racist, but racism isnt gone from society. I find it appalling that all these Ivy league attorneys, Judges, civic leaders both Black and White comment on this trial but ignore the weekly massacre in our cities. We need strong Honest leadership that cuts through the bullsit theatre that is the national media. I just want people to focus on the 5,7 and 12 year old kids shot in Chicago this weekend…no one knows there names…but everyone knows the names Martin and Zimmerman….a minor case fueling names like Sharpton Maddow and Hannity….dont be puppets focus on the reality of the situation. These people profit by keeping us at each others throats…while children die and we hate each other at one level or another. I find reverand Al the most reprehensible because he is REVERAND….I think clergy should be more responsible and represent Jesus better than most…..Maybe Im naive but it’s exactly how I feel Fellas.
Nothing naive about that X. Just the truth the media acts like inner cities like Chicago don’t exist until the violence seeps into the wrong neighborhoods. I also believe that racism these days is more about the haves and have nots and not about color.
Amen to that Big…they conspire to keep us afraid so that we wont have what they want. I dont want it anyway lol so the jokes on them.
you are speaking about two of the biggest industries in america and how profitable they are: 1. poverty! its huge business and 2. american criminal justice system and its penal system… both sides of the political isle profit, selected few from all races profit… it is a joke. 1st thing get rid of mandatory sentencing guidelines and 2nd thing legalize marijuana and third thing create some industrial jobs. f.ing politicians and civic leaders are a joke in this country
Look no further than many if the comments on this very site to understand how racism permeates our society. Far too many of you whites either gladly claim some reverse racism or accuse blacks of playing the race-card. You get pissed when people like me RESPOND to bigoted behavior/statements not in some unrelated sense; but again on topic and thread related.
If one was truly unbiased, devoid of racist feelings he would see Zimmerman’s actions as that of a sociopath. Bringing up that kid’s school suspensions, drug ise, or criminal history is no different than bringing up a rape victim’s sexual past. Is says more about their true feelings. And it ain’t for justice. Zimmerman had no way of knowing these things when he decided to stalk this kid. How manu blacks killed other blacks in Chicago has bo bearing in the RIGHT thing being done in THIS case. To inject all these other variables is an inexcusable divergence and THE TRUEST EXAMPLE OF PLAYING THE RACE CARD.
Zimmerman was 100% wrong he instigated the entire incident, brewski that has nothing to do with the issues in the inner cities my point is we need to focus on what’s wrong with the inner cities everyday instead of one case the MEDIA decides to throw at us every now and then.
Didn’t think you did big. Based on previous post; take you at your word. I’m also man enough to understand that much (actually most) of the violence on display in inner city Chicago wasn’t caused by the avg white person regardless of how many feel. It primarily begins and ends with those who inhabit these neighborhoods.
You’re correct coldbrewski. There is no excuse for following a guy to his home and killing him. Zimmerman should be behind bars.
For the record Irish I’d feel the same if the kid was white and raised by the kkk and with the murderer being a black civil rights pioneer. You and I agree on this one.
Why is it racism? The jury, based on the facts and the law delivered to them by Her honor, could not convict based on beyond the reasonable doubt standard.
The prosecution, like the prosecution on OJ, did a poor job on delivering, marshaling the facts against the law. The lawyers knew what the charge (law) would be explained to the jury, but they failed miserably in educating the jry about the law. The defense, in contrast, did exactly that and it explains, in my opinion this result.
Juries get it right; they are constrained by the facts and the law, but they get it right in my experience.
The prosecution talked a lot about Zimmerman’ s depraved heart, but didn’t specifically tie it in with the facts of this case.
A better prosecution would have Zimmerman behind bars, like OJ, where they both belong
Bottom line in many cases that have controversial decisions
Is the it is incumbent for the State (Prosecuters/Attorneys Office) to build an iron clad case where they prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the charged (defendant) is guilty as decided by a jury of their Peers
Once again we see an Prosecution Team making a weak case at best (like OJ’s) where the amateur Lawyering is evident by the overworked, underpaid Lawyers of County and city Prosecution Teams who are no match by the high profile, big $$$ Lawyers that most times the Defendant has hired or even have other groups pay for their elite representatives..
The Us Justice System is just like big business, politics and Governement in general, it’s about who has the resources to afford the best Lawyers, not about the letter of the law.. Justice anymore, goes to the side with the $$$..
Good points paulman, oj got a lot of justice, because he had money
And your commentary about American jurisprudence is accurate
See Jake, we can agree on some things once in a while.. Ha ha..