For years I’ve heard people say to avoid discussing politics and religion if you want avoid getting into a disagreement which could be uncontrollably contentious.¬† You can put the discussion of the Eagles decision to trade Donovan McNabb and promote Kevin Kolb to the starting job.
Do you ever watch the political coverage on CNN, Foxnews and MSNBC?¬† They could be covering the same event but have opinions about it, that are so vastly different that you have trouble believing that they’re talking about the same event.
The political climate in the nation is so divisive that people with differing opinions can’t even discuss the subjects without getting emotional and resulting to personal attacks.
It’s the same way with the coverage of McNabb and Kolb.¬† It seems that most people are on either one side or the other.
If you listen to or read the local coverage, you’ll be convinced that McNabb was an overrated bum who didn’t have leadership skills and should have been relinquished of his job a long-time ago.
If you checkout the national coverage of the trade, you will wonder allow why the Eagles were willing to trade a guy who led them to the playoffs so often.¬† You’ll also wonder why they were willing to trade such a consistent winner to a division rival.
If you checkout Philly.com this morning you will see glowing story about Kevin Kolb after glowing story about Kevin Kolb.¬† I’m not¬† wondering whether Kolb will lead the Eagles to a Super Bowl championship, but how many times will he lead them to Super Bowl titles.
I do think this young man will be a good quarterback but I’m not ready to put him in the Hall of Fame just yet.
At the same time, I realize that McNabb although a very good NFL quarterback is lacking some things.  Yet and still I have to acknowledge his ability to take the Eagles to the playoffs year after year.
Much like the political climate, an Eagles fan who thinks trading McNabb was a good decision and an Eagles fan who thinks it was a bad decision can’t have an intelligent conversation and respect the opinions of the other person.
Personally, I can see legitimate reasons why the Birds made the move as well as legitmate reasons why they shouldn’t have done it.
Ultimately this decision will judged by what happens on the field regardless of what is written and said about Kolb and McNabb.
As far as I’m concerned, the real question is whether Reid or McNabb is more responsible for the team’s inability to win a Superbowl.
I believe it was time to make a change a QB because, in large part, because the fans had grown tired of the McNabb/Reid tandem. I believe that Reid had become dependent upon McNabb’s big-play ability. Throughout the years, that dependency not only affected his play calling but also his drafting of players. Reid believed McNabb didn’t need top receivers to win a Superbowl, and it took him 10 YEARS to finally realize that he needed top-flight player makers to win in the NFL. 10 YEARS!!!!
Reid won a lot of games against a very weak NFC East, but was ineffective against upper echelon teams. Both his offense and defense disappeared in big games. If McNabb didn’t make a play, there was no play to be made. Even Westbrook was helpless against the better teams.
I think McNabb accomplished more with Reid’s predictable offense than most other quarterbacks could have. If you want to compare the QBs, the question is do you think Kolb could have done as much with Reid’s prior teams?
Right now, Kolb is an unknown. So any answer would be purely speculative.
This is definitely the “Valley of Pain” for this situation. One thing though is pretty certain, by the end of this upcoming season all the speculation will be over and it will be crystal clear what the quality of the Eagles decisions has been. Unfortunately everyone has to sit through a whole off-season and season of speculation and innuendo to find out.
G the local media are always field with people who are overly critical about the local players. That will never stop. Anyone who says McNabb is a bum or anything that comes close to that is an idiot. No he’s not th best QB in the league and he has his flaws. I hate that he throws too many balls in the dirt, that he throws the ball over the RB head on a swing pass and that on slants and drag routes the ball was often thrown behind the receiver. I can acknowlegde those things. But I like how he had to play with mediocre talent and put the team on his back. How he didn’t turn the ball over much. All the big plays he made with his arm and legs and his ability to go out there and have fun, play his game in the midst of all the criticism and controversy.
At the end of the day, I would have rather see Reid gone than McNabb because I think he was more of the problem with play calling and getting the right players to put us over the top. But just like you said, I don’t care what any of the “journalists” say. They are clueless and no one will know anything until they play. The thing about Kolb is that it will take a few years to actually know what you have because QBs go up and down all the time. But McNabb right now, is the best QB that ever put on an Eagles jersey and if anyone refuses to acknowledge that they are being irrational and a hater.
With that said, I hope Kolb turns out to be everything they think him to be. If not, Reid HAS to go.
A little over dramatic don’t you think guys..
With all the problems we are facing as a Nation, like Wars, a Stagnated Economy, a Broken Government, Lack of Leadership, Oil Spill, Budget Cuts for Schools,Libraries, Healthcare for the Elderly & Poor, the Arts,Music and even in Athletics… It seems pretty juvenile to be arguing over who should be at QB for the Eagles… It is after all, just a sport and not too important in the larger grand scheme of things.. It was time for McNabb to move on plain and simple and now it’s time for Kolb
Let’s see what he does with this great opportunity..
it was time in ur eyes mr mancini
there is no grey area here
its very black and white
no pun intended
pwill – I’ve tried to go down this road with you before, but what da heck. Since you are a self proclaimed ‘black and white thinker’ – why don’t you try google-ing ‘black and white thinking’ – check it out man. It’s a widely known fact that thinking like that is flawed, problematic, stupid, limited, and not attuned to reality. This isn’t me making this stuff up – it’s facts. Check it out and you might learn something.
Its actually called a borderline personality trait – the inability to see anything other then black and white – in a mild form it is failry common in military folks, police officers etc. but it is also a common trait in narcissitic people which is I think is much more the case with this particular person.
Donovan used to play here, now he doesn’t. I rooted for him then, now I don’t. They were a very good team with him as the quarterback, and now we get to see how they do with Kevin Kolb.I do not see what there is to argue about. Donovan is not here, he is not coming back. The players come and go, that is just how the NFL works. There is no need to get your panties in a bunch ladies, the players do not mind moving, they still get paid. They are not in Philadelphia because they like you, or care about you. It is just where their paychecks come from. Who worries about mercenaries? I just want them to play well.
To PW,
I take it that you think 11 years as the Franchise QB is not enough time to get the job the done..
and then you want to give Kolb 2-3 games to prove himself before benching… makes no sense….
Maybe this “Personality Trait” is part of the ingredients from “Delisandro’s”
Navy – yeah, but it’s also a common (error) in many mentally healthy people. It’s common human nature to some degree, but most people are able to grow out of it, learn to think beyond it or only do it to a point that doesn’t cause significant problems in their life. The most common therapeutic technique these days, CBT or Cognitive Behavior Therapy, includes becoming aware of and counteracting black and white thinking (similar to the ‘splitting’ of the personality disorders you mentioned). Most people who go to therapy for depression – not necessarily people with boderline or narcissitic personality disorders – have to be taught about and equipped with techniques to get beyond black and white (a.k.a. ‘all or nothing’ thinking. TWO FUNNY THINGS ABOUT THIS WHEN YOU THINK OF EAGLES AND THIS SITE – 1) Despite all the above, PW proudly identifies with this and 2) “Superbowl or Bust” is a classic example.
Well said Anderson..
Like Stephen Stills sang many a years ago…
“if you can’t be with the one you love, then love the one your with…”
well 11 yrs as head coach
u shouldnt get to pick another qb then
and schill idc what u say anymore
ur annoying just andy reid lil pet or something
ur team neva won shit trust them with ur heart they are always right lmao
Pw – case in point – you don’t like what I say so you assume I’m 100% the opposite of you – saying I’m an ‘andy reid li(tt)l(e) pet and that I think they’re always right. That’s far from the truth and I never said those things. I rarely say anything ovetly positive about Reid and I often disagree with things the team does. But you see me disagreeing with some stuff you say as being the polar opposite. I don’t see it as either Reid or McNabb. You do because you’re limited in you r thinking – extremely so. Maybe it’s more complicated, like the Eagles lost a superbowl to a team that was cheating during it. And McNabb plays one position on a team of 53 so his time here wasn’t all about his accomplishments or failures. And perhaps, just perhaps, winning the superbowl isn’t a perfect formula that ends in the best team with the best QB and best coach winning it – didn’t you just agree to that the other day!? But you’re addicted to simplicity – fine, but the world, and the NFL ain’t so simple.
Me – I am blatantly pro Reid – why – I coach, and I know that it is DAMN difficult to have repeated winning seasons, to repeatedly make the playoffs. It is physically, mentally and emotionally tiring. I am also well read and use statistics and data to form my opinions, complex opinions, not simple – we aint won the pill, rock, trophy or whatever crap slang we are using this week, so things like # of winning seasons, winning percentages, playoff wins, playoff win percentage when taken in the whole mean a great deal when I form my opinion of a coach. Sure, Jon Gruden, Mike Shanahan, Paul Holmgren, and Joe Gibbs have SB rings as head coaches, but I wouldn’t want any of them, but Tony Dungy and Bill Cowher would be excellent choices should Reid retire. I am overtly optimistic and truly think the eagles are a great organization (hence the 99% season tix repurchase even in this current economic malaise).
PW – I guess its easy to win 10 games a year, easy to win the NFC East a bunch of times, easy to get to the NFC Champ game a bunch of times – but I always thought when I managed to get my teams to the playoffs, and to win playoff games it was an accomplishment, as the other teams we were playing against didn’t seem to roll over for us – but then again, that is probably the biggest difference – I did it as a player, now I am (oops – I am not coaching this year) WAS doing it as a coach – you just write about it.
PW Why can’t you understand how difficult it is to win a superbowl. The Eagles have been trying since 1960 and haven’t done it yet. Why don’t you realize that you have not coached or played the game at any level and haven’t researched you statements in the annals of football expertise. Why can’t you be as excited as Howie Roseman about the Eagles season. Think of all the fans re-uping on season tickets
almost 100%. Why don’t you go on the Eagles website and try filling out the fan polls each day. You cannot pick a negative answer in these polls and perhaps this will be a form of CBT to combat your thinking. remember CBT not in the sense of B&D or S&M but in the Schiller sense ans try water therapy
as in the Navy sense.
BigE – that is a pretty funny post – but seriously – aren’t you excited – does the team ‘have’ to be favored to win the SB to get excited about the upcoming football season?
I try to have cautious optimism. I am not at the excited level right now. I’ll try to do better as time goes by. Maybe if PW would lead us in the Eagles fight song, I might rise to the occasion.
PW It‚Äôs a widely known fact that thinking like your’s is flawed, problematic, stupid, limited, and not attuned to reality. Think on the bright or multi-colored side and know that someday you can be like Schiller, if you do,happy that the Eagles are your home team, win or loose, that the FO knows best,that football is a very complex game which you may never fully understand but that each year their is some probability that they may reach the Super Bowl and even win. Don’t worry, be happy!
If Reid had quality receivers for #5 early in his career, this conversation would be mute…..
If Don had ever learned how to put some touch on the ball and improve his accuracy, this converation would be moot. I do however, wish some people around here were mute…
It was time for McNabb to go, and I say this as a McNabb fan admittedly. I think that things had run their course. Its a shame that Reid realized too late that additional weapons would have helped McNabb and this offense. I would have loved to have seen this team with weapons early on when the Eagles still had a great defense in the early 2000’s. I think where I get upset is the people that completely trash this man as if he was the worse ever. Did he have accuracy flaws at times?…yes… but he and Reid did a lot of winning over the years. I find it unfortunate that people automatically assume that Kolb will be better at running the offense than McNabb. He may be better at some point but just because we want it to be does not make it so. We have to see how he reacts over a full season to being the focal point of an opposing teams defense. Im not saying he WON’T be great, im just saying we need to wait and see but just because of “McNabb fatigue” we cant just assume that Kolb will be better. There have been many MANY instances where a highly touted quarterback fell flat. Lets just have a little respect for the legacy that Reid and McNabb built here in Philadelphia and hope that Kolb can be a suitable replacement.
PW Reid is the expert and at the time Thrash and Pinkston were the best he could come up with not to mention the other non spectaculars that in his expert opinion were going to be all pro, 8 or 9 guys I rather not mention. Reid knew that McNaab would throw high and low and in the dirt so he wanted non primadonnas who would risk injury to go after the ball. Look how Pinskston sacraficed his body over the middle because he once said he aspired to be like Jerry Rice and remember how Thrash had a Hall of Fame day against Asante when the Eagles played the Skins. This black and white thinking has to stop.
Reid’s win/loss record and reputation was built largely against a very weak NFC East. However, in recent years, the Division has improved and Reid’s teams have gone in the opposite direction. Is that because of Donovan? We’ll soon know.
Drummer – how have reid’s teams gone in the opposite direction in recent years? I don’t see it. They were in the NFC championship game a year ago, and then seriously depleted by injuries the next. I don’t see the pattern, and I doubt others do. The only real dip in the success came after the superbowl year, and since there’s been steady improvement back to 11 wins last year – with a 2 deep hole at MLB.
Drummer, This year will be critical. From 2000-2004 (5 yr) record 59-21-0. from 2005-2009 (5 yr) record 45-34-1.
The pattern of regular seasons wins seems to be down by 14. Is this what you mean. Unless they go 10-6-0 this year it will decline more because that was their 1999 record. Time will tell.
Good work making Drummer’s point easier to see. But my issue with it was his statement that ‘the division has improved and Reid’s teams have gone in the opoposite direction’ – not the case. Dallas won a WOING 1 playoff game over the period – over us with out our top 2 MLBs or C. NY declined and Washington has only improved if you buy into all of the new name hype of this offseason – that’s speculative. Meanwhile, over the past few years, the Eagles have added much more talent and their records are on an upswing. Given that 2005 (post SB) was the worst year in the period – not ‘recent’ – I just don’t see the trend the way Drummer expressed it and I’m not being ‘optimistic’ here – it’s numbers and plain facts.
Record wise – since 05, the Eagles and Cowboys are the only teams in the division that have improved over that period. And it can’t be ‘because of Donovan’ – he had one of his best (statistical) seasons last year, and HE’S ONLY 1 FREAKIN MAN. Nothing in football can be ‘because of the QB’ alone. See the Baltimore Ravens and NY Giants SB wins, or throw in the Steelers first if you’d like.
“G” the piece that makes the Mcnabb/Kolb discussion divisive is the “900 pound guerilla” in the room everyone ignore through alternative discussions….”Race”. There’s many fans who believe if Mcnabb was white he would still be an Eagle. Never in the history of the NFL have a quarterback with Mcnabb’s credentials,in the prime of their career had to deal with the scrutiny, and blatant disrespect Mcnabb had to endure during his successful tenure with the Eagles. There’s many who believe if Mcnabb was of another race, Kolb would not have been drafted and they would have surrounded him with an additional weapon instead of a eventual replacement. Mcnabb’s Athleticism made the organization dependant on his whodini antics to make a play when Andy’s predictable plays broke down, and through this depency ignored the fact the man needed help to get that ever so elusive SB. Now that the team now realize receivers are a needed commodity, they ship off their prize franchise player in order to allow Kolb to benefit from the same tools we were told Mcnabb did not need. Jim Kelly, John Elway, and Even Favre in his prime would have never been disrespected in such a manner, leaving us with the question..Do racism exists in sports? I’m not a racist….but a realist..The trade to the redskins was a blatant act of disrespect. “G”, that’s the reason he received a bonus last year…it’s called a “severence pay”.
DIsrepect… You are craxy Siongs..
#05 made about $120 Million while playing for PHiladelphia securing generations of his family to live well.
They even gave him extra $$$ before last season when they didn’t have to,then to top it off, they trade him to a intra-devision rival with a good offensive coach in Shannahan, a rabid fan base and a chance to get back at his former team Twice a year.. Please, let’s not shed any tears for # 05.. He’s a big-boy and may look back at this as a blessing to him.. 11 years was enough, it was time to move on, For real fans, it’s time to get over it and support the team and the players you have and if it doesn’t work out, within the next 2 years,then AR is the easy villian and goat and will no longer be Head Coach of the Eagles.
Trading McNabb was a smart move for a couple of reasons.
1. Age – How much longer does he have to play at a high level?
2. Money – How much would you need to pay to keep an aging declining player.
3. Value – Moving him now got you value in young players that could contribute for 10+ years far beyond the time 5 could give you. Also by trading up and down on draft day the legacy of the McNabb trade could continue to shape the team for years.
4. Kevin Kolb – He must have shown the coaches that he was ready. If he does not work out and the team falters badly this year We draft his replacement. If he works out we have a young offense that will grow together over the next 5-10 years.
One thing that should not be mentioned is Race. 1st there is only one Race Human anything else is a method of someone dividing us for political game. Politically we should do what is right for AMERICANS. I hate the adding of qualifiers like “african american” That qualifier to me is degrading and divisive. No one calls me a “european american”. If we could get rid of this Marxist progressive denegrating tags and see each other as “Americans” we would then be on the path that a great man like MLK wished for. Make no mistake we are all being used and played against one another to the benefit of an expanding government that would attempt to usurp our god given Individual Sovereignty.
big e i come in to work today after a nice weekend
phitans sweep the rockies (great call pman hehehe)
and i c this attack every 1 of your post has pw in it im flattered thanx
but your football knowledge is very limited and i cant even reply to it
you just made alligator arm pinkston a fearless wr lmao and i quote
“Reid knew that McNaab would throw high and low and in the dirt so he wanted non primadonnas who would risk injury to go after the ball. Look how Pinskston sacraficed his body over the middle because he once said he aspired to be like Jerry Rice”
very sad very very sad
PW in case you didn’t get it I was mocking Reid, Schiller and Navy. Maybe you had too much weekend wake up and see the humor.
yes i apologize clearly no1 would make pinkston fearless lol